Infill 3D SunBurn Hotend Review

[Dale]

I been researching and checking the SunBurn from Infill 3D you can see some pictures of it in this thread http://forum.seemecnc.com/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=6347" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; I started this new thread as a semireview of the hotend, quite frankly I usually do not make reviews for items but in this instance I am very pleased with the customer service of Infill 3D plus after doing some digging I think they been under rated and not many people know about them.
If you say all metal hotend it seems the de facto is E3D to which the Infill 3D has been labeled a clone, I am going to disagree with that statement but more on that later.
I am an architect by profession I have seen and used 3D printers in the past however, they where expensive commercial SLS machines, since I no longer work for the office that had those resources I decided to buy a 3D printer. If you are like me before buying an item you spend hours Googling everything you can to find out about such item to make an educated purchase, I ended in this forum since I settled on a delta printer.
I weighted heavily on the comments of my brother in law that is knee deep in the RepRap scene, the guy has 6 different 3D printers I think that says it all.
Straight out of the gate I am going to say that the Infill 3D hotend is a quality product that performs flawlessly, my brother in law has been printing with it almost non stop with ABS, PLA, PET+ and Ninjaflex without any issues at all. He printed all the parts and multiple extruders for the Infill 3D i3R what brings me to another point, not only they are making an excellent hotend their engineering skills for parts are superb (they are available for free download at their site http://www.infill3d.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and Thingiverse) the parts are not only functional they are beautiful, when most other equivalent parts I have seen have a blocky homemade look the Infill 3D parts look aesthetic pleasing and professional.
I have email Infill 3D 12 separate times since I became interested in their products and every time I got a response not only quickly but with detail explanations to all my questions.
Googling "Infill3D" gave me a thread in the RepRap forum from back in December '13 where an American gentleman was ruffling feathers with the British RepRapers arguing Infill 3D vs E3D interesting read lots of facts however, the big take away from that thread was that the main guy from E3D posted a comment where he stated that the Infill 3D was a copy of the E3D and play down it's small size a few months later here we are with the E3Dv6 and what a coincidence that it has the same dimensions as the Infill 3D, back then the E3Dv5 was considerable larger, who copied who?
When I first inquire about this hotend in this forum in the first reply I received I was told the Infill 3D SunBurn is a clone of the E3D and how the anodized color would make the "thermal performance worse" as I did my research I found that is quite the contrary on both counts, there is resistance working against the Infill 3D hotend from the community I find it a bit unfair I think is all in the misconception of looks.
I asked straight out to Infill 3D if they where a clone of the E3D along with other questions I got detail emails from them, I will read through them and post responses to some questions that I think are relevant and everyone that is interested in an all metal hotend should know. I should have it ready tonight or tomorrow.

[DavidF]

So Dale, where's a picture of this hot end running in a rostock?? Forgive me for being skeptical, but it seems to me you are trying to sell us on this hot end in the same way culligan tries to sell water filters. You.know what I would really like to see? A video of it printing ninja flex.....

[Nylocke]

I'm not really caring of "who dun it furst", this is the RepRap community, isn't it? This is sounding more like a patent war and less like an open source community.

I think the reception you received was because of the abundance of mediocre Prusa heat beds made from plated copper, or sketchy sub par Chinese manufactured RepRap goods sometimes encountered, often made "more appealing" by alternate colors, etc (ex, SainSmart) and so I think they took the anodized aluminum as for this kind of selling tactic.

I have had experience with E3d products and I like them quite a bit, though the V5s do have some quirks I will admit. I looked all over I3D's website several times the past 2 days and I do think there are some noticeable differences between the 2 designs, though they do have some similarities. Whoever "did it first" is irrelevant to me, since they are both RepRap Open Source designs (assuming the Sunburn is?), they both have a similar, but different, approach to solving design problems. At a glance, the Sunburn appears to have slightly thicker fins in the heatsink, though that could just be an illusion. Also the Steel heatbreak is considerably longer in comparison to both the V5 and V6. They have their own system to keep the thermistor in place, a set screw that traps the thermistor in place, different from the V6's approach as more of a strain relief design. Also I3D has chosen to do an external quick release fitting, vs E3d has come up with their own integrated fitting that also allows the Teflon tube to pass through up to the heatbreak. Also, as I mentioned in the last thread, I3D uses a different nozzle design, with a 120 degree tip, longer and sharper than the E3d, which in my experience leads to a better surface finish.

All put together, I see many differences between the two hotends, and I think they both have very excellent designs. I will stay with my E3d products, the Kraken wasn't cheap, for now (though I do want to try buying a few of their nozzles to test out), though I think that I3D has a very nice design and perhaps others may be interested in the Sunburn. It certainly looks like a fine product to me.

[626Pilot]

"Dale",

When E3D employees come to our forum, they announce themselves. They make their identities as E3D employees known, and they make it known clearly. They do not pretend to be casual users who aren't out to sell hot ends.

Now, let's look at you. You joined a couple weeks ago. Your first post pushes a hot end that has never been mentioned before on these forums. Almost every one of the posts you make after this is also about the same hot end. You seem to be inclined to defend your favored hot end in areas where it clearly, obviously, unambiguously doesn't deserve to be defended. For example, you ask, "who copied who". Go to your website, infill3d.com, and watch your flash animation. See how the nozzle, heat block, heat break (down to the little threadless section), and heat sink (down to the profile of the core diameters between the fins) are all the same as an E3D version 5. Well, who copied who indeed? That's pretty easy to answer. I3D copied E3D. Almost down to the name, even. The intention behind your posts has such a different smell from what I'd see if I looked at anyone else's post history.

If you're really just a casual user, maybe you can explain why your behavior is so unlike everyone else who posts here, why it seems to revolve around and have so much to do with this hot end. I realize I may be wrong, but this is all just so weird and hard to explain away with any other motivation.

[elmoret]

When I first inquire about this hotend in this forum in the first reply I received I was told the Infill 3D SunBurn is a clone of the E3D and how the anodized color would make the "thermal performance worse" as I did my research I found that is quite the contrary on both counts, there is resistance working against the Infill 3D hotend from the community I find it a bit unfair I think is all in the misconception of looks.

Anodization has no real impact on forced air convection. It improves radiative heat transfer, but this is negligible in a forced air heatsink. Actually if the anodization is performed incorrectly it will make the performance of a forced air heatsink worse.

I would strongly recommend that you do not make statements you do not know to be true when attempting to prove a new products worth, or at all for that matter.

[Dale]

Thank you all for your input, I think I hit a nerve with some people, I am not here to duke it out with anyone there is a few reasons why I attempted to convey what I found during my research for this hotend.
No other part that I checked has the interesting background that I saw in this part and I got so much information from the manufacturer taking the time to answer everything I asked, also I downloaded and used their parts for free but most important I truly believe it is a quality hotend.
Everyone in this forum has been very helpful with my questions in return I wanted to give back since that is what people do in a community like this one, share experiences.
Have you ever had dinner in a new place and got such good service that you felt generous and left behind a big tip? You didn't have to be generous but you did because you felt they deserve it; In fact you are so pleased that you recommend the place to other people.
That is how I feel with my dealings with Infill 3D, that does not make me an employee but a satisfied customer I am simply conveying the information I think is worth sharing, I do it because I believe is going to help the business and the client.
I will postpone posting the information I had planed since I do not want to be controversial, I am sure the administrator of the forum combs though the threads if you think this is getting out of hand please remove the thread.
I will check tomorrow if the thread still around I will post the information I wanted to share.

[DavidF]

Dale, the point we are trying to make is we dont want a sales pitch. Show us this nozzle in action on your rostock so we can see what it does first hand.
Or just loan me the hotend to try out and I will give it a non biased review. Better yet send it to Mhackney....

[Dale]

Dale, the point we are trying to make is we dont want a sales pitch. Show us this nozzle in action on your rostock so we can see what it does first hand.
Or just loan me the hotend to try out and I will give it a non biased review. Better yet send it to Mhackney....

David, I know you and Mhackney are a super cool guys but you do understand if I do not want to send my hotend to someone in a forum, no offense but I would not do that for anyone in the Internet. Contrary to what you guys believe I do not work for Infill 3D I paid for my hotend and although I would like Infill 3D to move forward it makes no difference to me who buys one. I like their products and I am giving my personal opinion but that's it, why don't you ask them for a hotend for review.
I should be clear about the parts that have been printed they where not done in a Rostock, those parts are going into my brother in law printer that he is changing into the Infill 3D printer.
I have almost all the parts to make a Rostock but I might trade everything I have and some cash for a commercial printer my brother in law has.
If I build the Rostock I will make you a video.

[626Pilot]

If I'm wrong, you have my apologies. How are you planning to do a review on it?