Dual extruders
- LorenOlepi
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Re: Dual extruders
Wanted to update you guys on the dual hot ends as it has been great getting multi-color and multi material prints
The adapter from trick laser = pretty sweet because you don't lose any height as it comes with smaller spacers and the offset is only in one direction... the only downside is that the led ring gets blocked a little but it's no big deal and I havn't found a decent solution for a peak fan
A little tip to get your offsets good in slicer is place the amount of steps in EEprom and then offset both extruders by the same amount in Slic3r.. other wise you will always be off center
So for the trick laser with the offset in the horizontal I got
EEprom:
Extr.1 x-offset steps = -1000
Extr.1 y-offset steps = 0
Extr.2 x-offset steps = 1000
Extr.2 y-offset steps = 0
Slic3r --> printer settings --> Extruder 1:
extruder offset: x = -12.5 y=0
Slic3r --> printer settings --> Extruder 2:
extruder offset: x = -12.5 y=0
I have also noticed that Slic3r always sets my second extruder temp initially to 235.. so I have just been editing the G-code to set it to the right temp
I also messed with a ton of custom tool change G-code but have found the best thing is just to do a retract of 15mm with a extra lenght of 1 mm for ABS/PLA and you wont get much leaking... a retract of 10mm for Hips seems to work fine
Also Slic3r runs M109 on every tool changes that makes the machine wait for it to reach temp... this causes little blobs where the extruders sit and a for a time delay. I've been changing all the m109's except the initial ones to M104's so that it doesn't wait = much happier
One last tip is to make sure randomize start point is off when doing multi-color prints as it will tend to leave streaks.
Hope this helps!!
The adapter from trick laser = pretty sweet because you don't lose any height as it comes with smaller spacers and the offset is only in one direction... the only downside is that the led ring gets blocked a little but it's no big deal and I havn't found a decent solution for a peak fan
A little tip to get your offsets good in slicer is place the amount of steps in EEprom and then offset both extruders by the same amount in Slic3r.. other wise you will always be off center
So for the trick laser with the offset in the horizontal I got
EEprom:
Extr.1 x-offset steps = -1000
Extr.1 y-offset steps = 0
Extr.2 x-offset steps = 1000
Extr.2 y-offset steps = 0
Slic3r --> printer settings --> Extruder 1:
extruder offset: x = -12.5 y=0
Slic3r --> printer settings --> Extruder 2:
extruder offset: x = -12.5 y=0
I have also noticed that Slic3r always sets my second extruder temp initially to 235.. so I have just been editing the G-code to set it to the right temp
I also messed with a ton of custom tool change G-code but have found the best thing is just to do a retract of 15mm with a extra lenght of 1 mm for ABS/PLA and you wont get much leaking... a retract of 10mm for Hips seems to work fine
Also Slic3r runs M109 on every tool changes that makes the machine wait for it to reach temp... this causes little blobs where the extruders sit and a for a time delay. I've been changing all the m109's except the initial ones to M104's so that it doesn't wait = much happier
One last tip is to make sure randomize start point is off when doing multi-color prints as it will tend to leave streaks.
Hope this helps!!
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Re: Dual extruders
Hey guys,
So I thought I had dual extruders working, but am having some weird problems whenever I have dual extruders active in a print.
Basically, the print will be fine for a few layers (with both extruders successfully extruding) and then, the printer behaves as if it ignores all subsequent z height changes. It prints all the remaining layers on top of each other at the same height, it "forgets" to raise for the next layer, but knows what new path it should be drawing at the next height it should have raised to. Sometimes I also hear sounds as if the steppers are skipping steps, and then the layers start misaligning.
When I switch back to all my single extruder settings, all of the problems stop, including the step skipping sounds, it prints normally, so I don't think I have any hardware issues. Loren, I do have a line that drops the z height right after the homing at the beginning of a print, thanks for that tip!
May I ask those who have sucessfully dual printed full models:
--what are the detailed printer settings in Slic3r? (Configure>Printer Settings) I've had some troubles when using "Lift"
--what version of Slic3r are you using? Maybe when I upgraded Slic3r that's what causes the problem?
--anything special in EEPROM besides extruder offsets?
--something other I may have missed in firmware other than the changes needed to get the second extruder motor and thermistor working?
So I thought I had dual extruders working, but am having some weird problems whenever I have dual extruders active in a print.
Basically, the print will be fine for a few layers (with both extruders successfully extruding) and then, the printer behaves as if it ignores all subsequent z height changes. It prints all the remaining layers on top of each other at the same height, it "forgets" to raise for the next layer, but knows what new path it should be drawing at the next height it should have raised to. Sometimes I also hear sounds as if the steppers are skipping steps, and then the layers start misaligning.
When I switch back to all my single extruder settings, all of the problems stop, including the step skipping sounds, it prints normally, so I don't think I have any hardware issues. Loren, I do have a line that drops the z height right after the homing at the beginning of a print, thanks for that tip!
May I ask those who have sucessfully dual printed full models:
--what are the detailed printer settings in Slic3r? (Configure>Printer Settings) I've had some troubles when using "Lift"
--what version of Slic3r are you using? Maybe when I upgraded Slic3r that's what causes the problem?
--anything special in EEPROM besides extruder offsets?
--something other I may have missed in firmware other than the changes needed to get the second extruder motor and thermistor working?
- LorenOlepi
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Re: Dual extruders
Sorry for the late response as my notifications haven't been working? I'm running slic3r 0.9.10b within repetier host v0.90cdesignfactore wrote:Hey guys,
So I thought I had dual extruders working, but am having some weird problems whenever I have dual extruders active in a print.
Basically, the print will be fine for a few layers (with both extruders successfully extruding) and then, the printer behaves as if it ignores all subsequent z height changes. It prints all the remaining layers on top of each other at the same height, it "forgets" to raise for the next layer, but knows what new path it should be drawing at the next height it should have raised to. Sometimes I also hear sounds as if the steppers are skipping steps, and then the layers start misaligning.
When I switch back to all my single extruder settings, all of the problems stop, including the step skipping sounds, it prints normally, so I don't think I have any hardware issues. Loren, I do have a line that drops the z height right after the homing at the beginning of a print, thanks for that tip!
May I ask those who have sucessfully dual printed full models:
--what are the detailed printer settings in Slic3r? (Configure>Printer Settings) I've had some troubles when using "Lift"
--what version of Slic3r are you using? Maybe when I upgraded Slic3r that's what causes the problem?
--anything special in EEPROM besides extruder offsets?
--something other I may have missed in firmware other than the changes needed to get the second extruder motor and thermistor working?
Here is my slic3r congif file I'm not sure what your talking about for lift?
See my earlier posts for EEprom and my firmware file
You don't have the spiral vase turned on do you??
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Re: Dual extruders
Dual extruders is very tempting because I have all the hardware to do it. Just wondering if anyone tried this w/ Kisslicer because that is my preferred slicer?
- LorenOlepi
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Re: Dual extruders
Running Dual E3D hotends now... here is the adapter I designed and currently using
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:219945
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:219945
Re: Dual extruders
And I am currently printing your adapter plates!
I had started this 2 days ago, but you beat me to the punch on it.
They look real nice so far.
I had started this 2 days ago, but you beat me to the punch on it.
They look real nice so far.
"Now you see why evil will always triumph! Because good is dumb." - Spaceballs
- LorenOlepi
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Re: Dual extruders
Excellent! I'm happy to hear others will be able to use it... I may make some changes like thinning out the bottom piece but I was able to install as is and it woks just fineFlateric wrote:And I am currently printing your adapter plates!
I had started this 2 days ago, but you beat me to the punch on it.
They look real nice so far.
- Eaglezsoar
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Re: Dual extruders
May I ask why the top part is so thick, I'm sure there is a reason but I am not bright enough to understand.LorenOlepi wrote:Running Dual E3D hotends now... here is the adapter I designed and currently using
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:219945
“ Do Not Regret Growing Older. It is a Privilege Denied to Many. ”
- LorenOlepi
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Re: Dual extruders
Oh your bright enoughEaglezsoar wrote:May I ask why the top part is so thick, I'm sure there is a reason but I am not bright enough to understand.LorenOlepi wrote:Running Dual E3D hotends now... here is the adapter I designed and currently using
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:219945
The top is "so thick" because to use the stock fan mounts I had to space out 32mm from center to center. This is too large of a gap for the stock fittings to fit through the center of the mounting plate so they needed to be on the bottom.of it. The top portion completely encases the hotends and the spacing is just enough to get the 4mm bowden tubes through the center.
- Eaglezsoar
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Re: Dual extruders
Thank you for the explanation, now I understand. Thank you for making this available to us.LorenOlepi wrote:Oh your bright enoughEaglezsoar wrote:May I ask why the top part is so thick, I'm sure there is a reason but I am not bright enough to understand.LorenOlepi wrote:Running Dual E3D hotends now... here is the adapter I designed and currently using
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:219945
The top is "so thick" because to use the stock fan mounts I had to space out 32mm from center to center. This is too large of a gap for the stock fittings to fit through the center of the mounting plate so they needed to be on the bottom.of it. The top portion completely encases the hotends and the spacing is just enough to get the 4mm bowden tubes through the center.
“ Do Not Regret Growing Older. It is a Privilege Denied to Many. ”
Re: Dual extruders
Because of the narrow opening in the stock Rostock MAX platform, I made my dual E3D adaptor place the E3Ds as close together as possible. That way the two bowden connectors actually fit through the platform...barely. I actually screw in the bowden's and align their edges *before* attaching the mount to the platform. It works although I need to make an alteration to my design for adjusting the height of one of the extruders because my 2nd extruder nozzle is a few tenths of a millimeter above the glass when the other one is touching the glass .
For anyone interested, here's the link to my mount for 2 E3Ds: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:217662
For anyone interested, here's the link to my mount for 2 E3Ds: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:217662
- LorenOlepi
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Re: Dual extruders
No problem. Let me know if you need anything modified on it
- Eaglezsoar
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Re: Dual extruders
Do you remember the infill you used? I am going to print two of these and I want to make sure I make them strong enough. (I have two Rostock Maxs)LorenOlepi wrote:No problem. Let me know if you need anything modified on it
“ Do Not Regret Growing Older. It is a Privilege Denied to Many. ”
- LorenOlepi
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Re: Dual extruders
I did the top at .125 and the smaller bottom piece solid but it could be over kill
- LorenOlepi
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Re: Dual extruders
Nice job! Its awesome how we both were working on the same problem at the same time As I've been putting it off for a month and finally got some time over the holidays to put one together. My heights were off a C-hair at first as well, a quick hit with the file took care of thatdpmacri wrote:Because of the narrow opening in the stock Rostock MAX platform, I made my dual E3D adaptor place the E3Ds as close together as possible. That way the two bowden connectors actually fit through the platform...barely. I actually screw in the bowden's and align their edges *before* attaching the mount to the platform. It works although I need to make an alteration to my design for adjusting the height of one of the extruders because my 2nd extruder nozzle is a few tenths of a millimeter above the glass when the other one is touching the glass .
For anyone interested, here's the link to my mount for 2 E3Ds: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:217662
After having my stock dual SeeMe hotends all but touching each other I wanted to keep them farther apart this time to help with temp control and to see if it will help with the second extruder dragging into the perimeters of the print. I truly didn't mind loosing the height as I rarely print anything that reaches the MAX on my MAX
Re: Dual extruders
Thanks -- yours is nice too! The time off at Christmas break was what gave me the opportunity to design something (after not having found something that would work ), too! I just haven't had a chance to modify my file to accommodate for my height difference, yet, but that's my plan as well -- thanks for the tip!LorenOlepi wrote:Nice job! Its awesome how we both were working on the same problem at the same time As I've been putting it off for a month and finally got some time over the holidays to put one together. My heights were off a C-hair at first as well, a quick hit with the file took care of thatdpmacri wrote:Because of the narrow opening in the stock Rostock MAX platform, I made my dual E3D adaptor place the E3Ds as close together as possible. That way the two bowden connectors actually fit through the platform...barely. I actually screw in the bowden's and align their edges *before* attaching the mount to the platform. It works although I need to make an alteration to my design for adjusting the height of one of the extruders because my 2nd extruder nozzle is a few tenths of a millimeter above the glass when the other one is touching the glass .
For anyone interested, here's the link to my mount for 2 E3Ds: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:217662
After having my stock dual SeeMe hotends all but touching each other I wanted to keep them farther apart this time to help with temp control and to see if it will help with the second extruder dragging into the perimeters of the print. I truly didn't mind loosing the height as I rarely print anything that reaches the MAX on my MAX
- LorenOlepi
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Re: Dual extruders
Just as a heads up... I was having a hard time leveling my dual extruders with my new mounting plate and then I placed a spring in-between the mounting adapter and the plate on each screw (3X) and now it can be leveled in no time!
Re: Dual extruders
Nice! I'll have to check that out since I've been having the same problem. I actually modified my design to account the the gap but then realized my modification wasn't printable .LorenOlepi wrote:Just as a heads up... I was having a hard time leveling my dual extruders with my new mounting plate and then I placed a spring in-between the mounting adapter and the plate on each screw (3X) and now it can be leveled in no time!
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Re: Dual extruders
I know that this is a tough question to answer sometimes but could you give a rough guess on the length and tension of the spring you used?LorenOlepi wrote:Just as a heads up... I was having a hard time leveling my dual extruders with my new mounting plate and then I placed a spring in-between the mounting adapter and the plate on each screw (3X) and now it can be leveled in no time!
I have several hundred springs here and I never know which one to use.
- LorenOlepi
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Re: Dual extruders
[quote="Eaglezsoar"
I know that this is a tough question to answer sometimes but could you give a rough guess on the length and tension of the spring you used?
I have several hundred springs here and I never know which one to use.[/quote]
I ended up using the ones that came from the Makerfarm Prusa leveling kit http://www.makerfarm.com/index.php/i3-p ... g-kit.html as they were the first ones I found...
They were about an inch long... and have a "medium" stiffness.
I know that this is a tough question to answer sometimes but could you give a rough guess on the length and tension of the spring you used?
I have several hundred springs here and I never know which one to use.[/quote]
I ended up using the ones that came from the Makerfarm Prusa leveling kit http://www.makerfarm.com/index.php/i3-p ... g-kit.html as they were the first ones I found...
They were about an inch long... and have a "medium" stiffness.
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Re: Dual extruders
Great, I just bought the Makerfarm Prusa I3 8" kit and it comes with that leveling kit.
Thanks so much!
Thanks so much!
- LorenOlepi
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Re: Dual extruders
That's awesome... I did too. I almost have mine competed but thinking I'm going to grab another E3D before I start calibrating.Eaglezsoar wrote:Great, I just bought the Makerfarm Prusa I3 8" kit and it comes with that leveling kit.
Thanks so much!
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Re: Dual extruders
How do you plan to mount the E3D to the Prusa I3?LorenOlepi wrote:That's awesome... I did too. I almost have mine competed but thinking I'm going to grab another E3D before I start calibrating.Eaglezsoar wrote:Great, I just bought the Makerfarm Prusa I3 8" kit and it comes with that leveling kit.
Thanks so much!
- LorenOlepi
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Re: Dual extruders
I'll design a new mountEaglezsoar wrote:How do you plan to mount the E3D to the Prusa I3?LorenOlepi wrote:That's awesome... I did too. I almost have mine competed but thinking I'm going to grab another E3D before I start calibrating.Eaglezsoar wrote:Great, I just bought the Makerfarm Prusa I3 8" kit and it comes with that leveling kit.
Thanks so much!
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Re: Dual extruders
I sure hope that you are the sharing type. Hint