Nylon
Nylon
Looking for Nylon printing experiences and tips. I have a potential 3Dhubs customer looking for nylon work, specifically black nylon (although dye is an option).
I have the typical blue trimmer nylon although I'm not sure if the characteristics are the same as Taulman's. Surface adhesion seems to be an issue.
I've tried:
PEI: no way, too slick
Kapton tape: lays okay then self detaches.
Blue painters tape: lays decent, somewhat easy to peel off. Need to perform a long print.
Glue stick: seems okay. Might be the best option out of the few tests.
clean glass: nope
aluminium: nope
Carbon fiber: like kapton, lays then comes off easy.
Epoxy over CF^: nope
Matte adhesive spray: does okay, kind of like the blue tape.
Any suggestions or tips would be awesome. Also, anyone print with black nylon?
I have the typical blue trimmer nylon although I'm not sure if the characteristics are the same as Taulman's. Surface adhesion seems to be an issue.
I've tried:
PEI: no way, too slick
Kapton tape: lays okay then self detaches.
Blue painters tape: lays decent, somewhat easy to peel off. Need to perform a long print.
Glue stick: seems okay. Might be the best option out of the few tests.
clean glass: nope
aluminium: nope
Carbon fiber: like kapton, lays then comes off easy.
Epoxy over CF^: nope
Matte adhesive spray: does okay, kind of like the blue tape.
Any suggestions or tips would be awesome. Also, anyone print with black nylon?
Re: Nylon
I've had decent results with gluestick on glass (as hot as you can get it, 100+c), but even then I have to use a very wide brim to keep things stuck down. And it's still basically impossible to print large things with high infill, at least without a heated chamber.
- Jimustanguitar
- ULTIMATE 3D JEDI
- Posts: 2631
- Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 1:35 am
- Location: Notre Dame area
- Contact:
Re: Nylon
Gluestick works well for me, too. I think Taulman's site says to apply PVA to your bed. I've got some, in filament form, but haven't goofed with it.
Re: Nylon
Sounds like a good starting point. Thanks!
The company is designing a two piece wall-mounted tablet case. The base would be rigid and the top would be flexible to an extent.
I've ordered Taulman PCTPE and Nylon 320 to handle the flexible part (I hope). He's going to order a few test pieces first to determine the thickness needed for the flexibility desired.
The company is designing a two piece wall-mounted tablet case. The base would be rigid and the top would be flexible to an extent.
I've ordered Taulman PCTPE and Nylon 320 to handle the flexible part (I hope). He's going to order a few test pieces first to determine the thickness needed for the flexibility desired.
Re: Nylon
PVA glue, not filamentJimustanguitar wrote:Gluestick works well for me, too. I think Taulman's site says to apply PVA to your bed. I've got some, in filament form, but haven't goofed with it.
50% glue-all, 50% water.
- bvandiepenbos
- Printmaster!
- Posts: 927
- Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:25 pm
- Location: Goshen, IN
- Contact:
Re: Nylon
Birch hobby plywood sanded smooth, no heat ?
~*Brian V.
RostockMAX v2 (Stock)
MAX METAL "ShortyMAX"
MAX METAL Rostock MAX Printer Frame
NEMESIS Air Delta v1 & v2 -Aluminum delta printers
Rostock MAX "KITT" - Tri-Force Frame
GRABER i3 "Slim"
RostockMAX v2 (Stock)
MAX METAL "ShortyMAX"
MAX METAL Rostock MAX Printer Frame
NEMESIS Air Delta v1 & v2 -Aluminum delta printers
Rostock MAX "KITT" - Tri-Force Frame
GRABER i3 "Slim"
- Windshadow
- Printmaster!
- Posts: 526
- Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2015 6:35 pm
- Location: Mid Coast Maine
Re: Nylon
yep i think i had some yellow carpenters glue that was PVAJFettig wrote:PVA glue, not filamentJimustanguitar wrote:Gluestick works well for me, too. I think Taulman's site says to apply PVA to your bed. I've got some, in filament form, but haven't goofed with it.
50% glue-all, 50% water.
Re: Nylon
Yes, when taulman says "pva" they specify:
PVA
(PVA is 50% water and 50% "Elmers Glue All")
http://www.taulman3d.com/910-features.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Not sure if that will work for trimmer line but 910 prints quite nice on it
PVA
(PVA is 50% water and 50% "Elmers Glue All")
http://www.taulman3d.com/910-features.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Not sure if that will work for trimmer line but 910 prints quite nice on it
Re: Nylon
awesome, PVA is easy enough to use. Looks like Taulman did all the hard work with providing the base settings for their products.
http://www.taulman3d.com/best-print-settings.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
This blue weed whacker nylon seems a bit harder to dial in. Might as-well toss this aside and use nylon made for printing.
Then I just need to figure out the black issue.
http://www.taulman3d.com/best-print-settings.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
This blue weed whacker nylon seems a bit harder to dial in. Might as-well toss this aside and use nylon made for printing.
Then I just need to figure out the black issue.
-
- Printmaster!
- Posts: 446
- Joined: Sun Jun 30, 2013 5:52 pm
- Location: Orange County, CA
- Contact:
Re: Nylon
The blue trimmer line is AWESOME for printing. I printed well over 50 pounds of the stuff before there were nylon filaments available.
As with all nylons, you need to ensure it's thoroughly dry before you print with it.
55-65C with elmer's glue stick will work with most parts. You'll likely want to use a brim or a raft for parts larger than 100mm diameter.
255-265C for optimum interlayer adhesion.
Use a 0.6 or 0.8mm nozzle for insanely strong/durable parts
As with all nylons, you need to ensure it's thoroughly dry before you print with it.
55-65C with elmer's glue stick will work with most parts. You'll likely want to use a brim or a raft for parts larger than 100mm diameter.
255-265C for optimum interlayer adhesion.
Use a 0.6 or 0.8mm nozzle for insanely strong/durable parts
Fellow Philosophy majors unite!
"The proverbial achilles heel of property monistic epiphenomenalism is the apparent impossibility of ex-nihilo materialization of non-structural and qualitatively new causal powers."
"The proverbial achilles heel of property monistic epiphenomenalism is the apparent impossibility of ex-nihilo materialization of non-structural and qualitatively new causal powers."
Re: Nylon
I have an unusually large supply of desiccant I keep my filament in. The Taulman nylon came in today, I'll shove that in the drum for a week or so before I start testing it.
Also ordered a Garolite LE sheet that is suppose to be the PEI equivalent for nylons.
I'll have to mess with the blue stuff a little more for sure.
Also ordered a Garolite LE sheet that is suppose to be the PEI equivalent for nylons.
I'll have to mess with the blue stuff a little more for sure.
- Eaglezsoar
- ULTIMATE 3D JEDI
- Posts: 7185
- Joined: Sun Apr 01, 2012 5:26 pm
Re: Nylon
The plywood idea from Brian is a good idea. I have read in many places about using sanded plywood (cabinet grade) as a base for printing all
nylons. No heat needed. If you can get your hands on a small piece it would certainly be worth a try.
nylons. No heat needed. If you can get your hands on a small piece it would certainly be worth a try.
-
- Printmaster!
- Posts: 446
- Joined: Sun Jun 30, 2013 5:52 pm
- Location: Orange County, CA
- Contact:
Re: Nylon
Desiccant alone won't dry it out. It will keep it dry, but you'll need some heat to dry it out.
You can use a 40-60w incandescent light bulb inside a bucket, or throw it in an oven at 180-190F for 4-6 hours.
You can use a 40-60w incandescent light bulb inside a bucket, or throw it in an oven at 180-190F for 4-6 hours.
Fellow Philosophy majors unite!
"The proverbial achilles heel of property monistic epiphenomenalism is the apparent impossibility of ex-nihilo materialization of non-structural and qualitatively new causal powers."
"The proverbial achilles heel of property monistic epiphenomenalism is the apparent impossibility of ex-nihilo materialization of non-structural and qualitatively new causal powers."
Re: Nylon
I tried printing some nylon last night on my PEI bed.
At 105 degrees bed and 240 nozzle, it stuck nicely. Until the second layer that is... Nylon looks to be a lot more fussy with regard to temperature than the other filaments I've tried.
I have some R/C modelling birch plywood, it's really thin, and will try printing on top of that this weekend.
At 105 degrees bed and 240 nozzle, it stuck nicely. Until the second layer that is... Nylon looks to be a lot more fussy with regard to temperature than the other filaments I've tried.
I have some R/C modelling birch plywood, it's really thin, and will try printing on top of that this weekend.
Re: Nylon
I used to print on paper. White printer papare works just well with many filaments.
I don't do that anymore since it gets messy when you remove the part, and need to scrap the paper off the glass. However, I would definitely give it a try if I ever need to print a filament that does not stick to anything else.
I don't do that anymore since it gets messy when you remove the part, and need to scrap the paper off the glass. However, I would definitely give it a try if I ever need to print a filament that does not stick to anything else.
Re: Nylon
nebbian wrote:I tried printing some nylon last night on my PEI bed.
At 105 degrees bed and 240 nozzle, it stuck nicely. Until the second layer that is... Nylon looks to be a lot more fussy with regard to temperature than the other filaments I've tried.
I have some R/C modelling birch plywood, it's really thin, and will try printing on top of that this weekend.
Nylon generally won't stick to PEI. Lulzbot recommends using a PVA solution to force it to stick.
Re: Nylon
Hmmmm. I tried the birch plywood last night, and again the nylon peeled itself off after the first few layers. It seems that Nylon has even more of a warp-tendency than ABS. I find that hard to believe, but there you go.
I'll try the PVA solution on top of the plywood next (don't really want to put it on my lovely PEI surface).
I'll try the PVA solution on top of the plywood next (don't really want to put it on my lovely PEI surface).
Re: Nylon
are you using blue trimmer line or some type of exotic taulman filament? Are you drying it in an oven first? If so, is the oven electric or gas? What are your print settings? What is the part you are tryin to print?nebbian wrote:Hmmmm. I tried the birch plywood last night, and again the nylon peeled itself off after the first few layers. It seems that Nylon has even more of a warp-tendency than ABS. I find that hard to believe, but there you go.
I'll try the PVA solution on top of the plywood next (don't really want to put it on my lovely PEI surface).
Re: Nylon
I'm using nylon from here:TFMike wrote:are you using blue trimmer line or some type of exotic taulman filament? Are you drying it in an oven first? If so, is the oven electric or gas? What are your print settings? What is the part you are tryin to print?nebbian wrote:Hmmmm. I tried the birch plywood last night, and again the nylon peeled itself off after the first few layers. It seems that Nylon has even more of a warp-tendency than ABS. I find that hard to believe, but there you go.
I'll try the PVA solution on top of the plywood next (don't really want to put it on my lovely PEI surface).
http://www.aurarum.com.au/other-materia ... ralia.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Nylon was stored in a ziplock bag with dessicant as soon as it was taken out of the original packaging, it's not foaming or spitting when I get the temperature right.
Printing at 237/230 degrees, with bed temps of 105/100, layer height of 0.3mm, printing this:
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:16510" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I only get a couple of layers into the bottom square before the warping grabs the piece and peels it off the bed.
Re: Nylon
Try applying a PVA solution or glue stick to a cold bed and dont heat it up so hot. Between 40-90 degrees C should hopefully be enough. Also, try adding a significant brim to the part to keep it stuck to the bed.
If that doesnt work then go with the extreme solution of just squriting white school glue directly onto the bed and then smooth it out with a credit or business card.
If that doesnt work then go with the extreme solution of just squriting white school glue directly onto the bed and then smooth it out with a credit or business card.
Re: Nylon
guidance:
https://www.matterhackers.com/articles/ ... with-nylon" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
https://www.matterhackers.com/articles/ ... with-nylon" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
- Eaglezsoar
- ULTIMATE 3D JEDI
- Posts: 7185
- Joined: Sun Apr 01, 2012 5:26 pm
Re: Nylon
Thanks for the link Sonrisa3D.
That was a quick but good read.
That was a quick but good read.
-
- Printmaster!
- Posts: 446
- Joined: Sun Jun 30, 2013 5:52 pm
- Location: Orange County, CA
- Contact:
Re: Nylon
100 is too hot for the bed.
60-70C. Elmer's glue on glass, buildtak, or pei should all work.
It doesn't shrink as much as ABS, but with that much heat it will.
Nylon has a lower Tg than ABS - 45-70C depending on the polymer. Having the bed at 100+C puts you well past Tg, and thus, you'll have trouble with curling and warping.
There's no need to reinvent the wheel here. I've printed well over 50 pounds of nylon. Dry the nylon. Glue on glass (or PEI, or buildtak... it's sticking to the glue, not the surface), 60-70C bed. Brim may be necessary on larger prints.
Done and done.
60-70C. Elmer's glue on glass, buildtak, or pei should all work.
It doesn't shrink as much as ABS, but with that much heat it will.
Nylon has a lower Tg than ABS - 45-70C depending on the polymer. Having the bed at 100+C puts you well past Tg, and thus, you'll have trouble with curling and warping.
There's no need to reinvent the wheel here. I've printed well over 50 pounds of nylon. Dry the nylon. Glue on glass (or PEI, or buildtak... it's sticking to the glue, not the surface), 60-70C bed. Brim may be necessary on larger prints.
Done and done.
Fellow Philosophy majors unite!
"The proverbial achilles heel of property monistic epiphenomenalism is the apparent impossibility of ex-nihilo materialization of non-structural and qualitatively new causal powers."
"The proverbial achilles heel of property monistic epiphenomenalism is the apparent impossibility of ex-nihilo materialization of non-structural and qualitatively new causal powers."
Re: Nylon
From what I've read in the past, the most important part is getting that Nylon dried.
Cope, you should post pics of some of the Nylon gears you've produced.
g.
Cope, you should post pics of some of the Nylon gears you've produced.
g.
Delta Power!
Defeat the Cartesian Agenda!
http://www.f15sim.com - 80-0007, The only one of its kind.
http://geneb.simpits.org - Technical and Simulator Projects
Defeat the Cartesian Agenda!
http://www.f15sim.com - 80-0007, The only one of its kind.
http://geneb.simpits.org - Technical and Simulator Projects
-
- Printmaster!
- Posts: 446
- Joined: Sun Jun 30, 2013 5:52 pm
- Location: Orange County, CA
- Contact:
Re: Nylon
Ask and ye shall receive.
Hot off the machine in freshly dried blue trimmer line (dried in a vacuum oven @ 150F)
This gear goes on a 36v 600w electric skateboard and can take a 250-300lb rider 20+ mph for 8-10 miles.
I made and sold 400-500 of these things from 2012-2014 and I saw exactly 4 break - 2 of those were user error.
This stuff is indestructible, prints buttery smooth when dry, and has very little warp.
I modeled my part in Solidworks with a .5mm thick brim. You can see it in the first picture, and the finished piece with the brim removed.
If you pull the part off while it's still warm, the brim comes off pretty easily with a swift yank. If you let it fully cool, you need a sharp razor to trim it off. Nylon is tough stuff.
FWIW, I have access to 50+ different filaments at work, and I get a half dozen new sample filaments to test every month or so, and the blue trimmer line is still my favorite material to print with.
Just plain awesome.
Happy Printing!
Hot off the machine in freshly dried blue trimmer line (dried in a vacuum oven @ 150F)
This gear goes on a 36v 600w electric skateboard and can take a 250-300lb rider 20+ mph for 8-10 miles.
I made and sold 400-500 of these things from 2012-2014 and I saw exactly 4 break - 2 of those were user error.
This stuff is indestructible, prints buttery smooth when dry, and has very little warp.
I modeled my part in Solidworks with a .5mm thick brim. You can see it in the first picture, and the finished piece with the brim removed.
If you pull the part off while it's still warm, the brim comes off pretty easily with a swift yank. If you let it fully cool, you need a sharp razor to trim it off. Nylon is tough stuff.
FWIW, I have access to 50+ different filaments at work, and I get a half dozen new sample filaments to test every month or so, and the blue trimmer line is still my favorite material to print with.
Just plain awesome.
Happy Printing!
Fellow Philosophy majors unite!
"The proverbial achilles heel of property monistic epiphenomenalism is the apparent impossibility of ex-nihilo materialization of non-structural and qualitatively new causal powers."
"The proverbial achilles heel of property monistic epiphenomenalism is the apparent impossibility of ex-nihilo materialization of non-structural and qualitatively new causal powers."