Alternative Heated Enclosure for Rostock MAX

[rymnd]

(copy-pasted from a thread I made in the deltabots google group)

Have been testing a heated enclosure for my Rostock MAX a while back and thought I'd post some details here in case anyone else would find it useful and if anyone else has tried something similar with better results.

Instead of enclosing the entire machine, I added clips that attached to the existing Rostock MAX V1 structure and then bolted polycarbonate sheets to that. I moved the extruder stepper to the outside of the enclosed space, so that no steppers are in the heated environment. The material choice certainly is not great (or even good) for insulation, but hey, if you can't see your delta machine at work, then what's the point? =P

For heating, I tried both a small space heater and an IR heat lamp. I want to try a ceramic heat emitter next, but I think the results will be similar to that for the IR heat lamp. The heating elements were controlled via an STC-1000 temperature controller and powered separately from the rest of the machine. With only the heated bed running, I got an internal temperature of around 25C. My printer's in a rather cold lab space that's usually around 20-21C. Both the IR lamp and the space heater could push the enclosure temperature up to around 42C, though the space in the immediate vicinity of both heaters could get as high as 60-65C. For reference, the Stratasys uPrint and Fortus machines run w/ a heated environment with 80-90C ambient.

I have not yet tried running both simultaneously, and I'm not sure how the lifespan of either heating element will be affected by the temperature controller turning them of and off repeatedly. In terms of aesthetics and efficiently utilizing space, I really like the IR lamp placement, and if I place the temperature controller thermocouple on the moving effector, I think I can actually modulate the temperature with respect to the layer height, which could be really cool, though not necessarily useful.

Suggestions and questions are welcome!

[enggmaug]

nice

[McSlappy]

That does look really cool! Well done.

I'm interested in your effector plate / mount you have there. Got any close ups of that too?

[Eaglezsoar]

That does look really cool! Well done.

I'm interested in your effector plate / mount you have there. Got any close ups of that too?

I second that one. It appears to be magnetic with a different end cups on the rods and a different effector.
Would love more info.

[rymnd]

That does look really cool! Well done.

I'm interested in your effector plate / mount you have there. Got any close ups of that too?

I second that one. It appears to be magnetic with a different end cups on the rods and a different effector.
Would love more info.

Sure. I detail it a bit more here: http://blog.rymnd.com/articles/rostock-upgrades/, and I had briefly discussed some earlier work here: http://forum.seemecnc.com/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=4433

I'm pretty close to giving up on the passive tool-changer. A bit difficult finding that sweet spot where I can reliably disengage the hotend while also ensuring that it'll stay put during long print jobs with fast moves. As is, it's still a nice quick-swap setup that lets me easily swap out the hotend for me dial guage and whatnot

[teoman]

What problems would one encounter if the entire machine was put inside a cupboard?

I am not a great fan of building more structures outside the printer. I think that it is much less of a hassle just to put the machine inside a bigger enclosure if you are not really really tight on space.

WOuld the rambo electronics suffer? Or would the stepper motors overheat?

And would dedicated fans to each motor provide anything?

[Jimustanguitar]

I've thought about this too. Maybe a cheap closet organizer cube that's big enough...

Curious to hear what others say.

[teoman]

How would you mount a fan to the steppers?

[teoman]

And do we know the design parameters?

Are we going for minimal air current on prints or elevated temperatures.

Would a heater fan be beneficial or detrimental?

[bdjohns1]

How would you mount a fan to the steppers?

Think a CPU heatsink+fan kind of setup.

I think the issue with enclosing the entire printer is that most of the electronics that aren't on the hot end or the heated bed don't really like the 70C ambient temperature that's supposedly the sweet spot for ABS printing without warp (based on how Stratasys does their enclosures). I already have issues with the electronics in the base getting too warm if I run my heated bed at 115C for a while. So, you want as few things as possible inside the heated volume of the machine.

Once you hit 70-80C, I think I remember reading some spec sheets saying that <10% of a part's warping will occur if you maintain temperatures above 70C, so air flow inside the heated volume becomes less sensitive to drafts - although you don't want too much airflow over the hotend itself to prevent cooling, although having the heated volume might allow you to use a fan to improve bridging behavior.

At some point, I'm going to swap out my Rambo for a Smoothieboard, and I'm not going to bother with trying to mount it inside the base - I'm just going to bring it to a little box outside the machine, with its own cooling fan.

[Polygonhell]

A fan on the stepper isn't going to help much if the ambient temperature is 60C+, the point of a fan is to move hot air out of the way to be replaced by ambient air.
One of the nice things about rostock style printers is that the steppers and electronics can be easily kept outside of a heated chamber.

[teoman]

Is the front side of your machine not closed?

[Polygonhell]

I have a very early V1 from the kick-starter, I never bothered with the rap around cover, so my motors are basically exposed to the outside, the XY/Z stepper shouldn't get very hot, they just don't need the high current setting and mine don't, the extruder motor does, but within tolerances.
My electronics bay is closed and I have a 80mm fan blowing air onto the back of the Rambo board which is sufficient to keep the stepper drivers cool.

In my comment I was more referring to the idea of putting the entire machine is a cupboard rather than enclosing the print area, there are substantial advantages to doing the latter.

[teoman]

If it is an off the shelf cupboard with several shelves. I could cut a big hole in in one of the shelves and position it such that only the top part sticks out.

[bdjohns1]

One other thing - apparently, the e3d hotend's little fan can have problems cooling the hotend enough if the ambient temperature is much above 60C. I don't think that's as much of an issue printing ABS - the active cooling is most critical for jam-free PLA printing, and you don't want a heated build chamber for PLA.

[teoman]

That is good to know. So for cupboard installations you need active cooling of the chamber. I.e. air evacuation from the build chamber.

[Renha]

What about water cooling?

[teoman]

Entering the realm of highly modded PCs now.

[Renha]

Entering the realm of highly modded PCs now.

for example, Krakeners already have water cooling, i think attaching water radiator to stepper isn't kind of rocket science.
If one doesn't want water, he could use Peltier elements between servo and radiator

[teoman]

I have peltier elements and some of the supplies neede for water cooling. Not sure how to cool the controller though.

Just cutting a hole in the cupboard shelf is starting to become more attractive complication wise...

I will visit the rejects part of ikea when I get back home.

[BONE]

Great setup, giving me ideas for my own.

[teoman]

Please do share...

[teoman]

I think that i really do need an enclosure.

RIght now here it is 34+ degrees C. And it is so humid i am sweating like crazy, so it feels more like 50 degrees.

Some of this moisture is creeping in to the ABS filament. While waiting for the hot end to heat up, i can hear it popping and crackling, as a result gas forms and the pressure forces some filament out, it looks almost as if the exruder is working.

So i think that i will really have to construct a dehumidified chamber for my printer...


So, for the peltier dehumidifier, if i do really suck power from the power supply of the rostock, i will have to leave it on all the time.

Anyone see any problems?

[Mac The Knife]

I think that i really do need an enclosure.

RIght now here it is 34+ degrees C. And it is so humid i am sweating like crazy, so it feels more like 50 degrees.

Some of this moisture is creeping in to the ABS filament. While waiting for the hot end to heat up, i can hear it popping and crackling, as a result gas forms and the pressure forces some filament out, it looks almost as if the exruder is working.

So i think that i will really have to construct a dehumidified chamber for my printer...


So, for the peltier dehumidifier, if i do really suck power from the power supply of the rostock, i will have to leave it on all the time.

Anyone see any problems?

I need to put one of these together.. http://forum.seemecnc.com/viewtopic.php?f=80&t=5826

[teoman]

Cool, thanks for that link.

No matter how much I read this forum, I seem to miss those little nuggets.