Temp Undefined, possible broken heater for HE280

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Brodensears
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Temp Undefined, possible broken heater for HE280

Postby Brodensears » Tue Sep 11, 2018 6:00 pm

When trying to heat up both the nozzle and the bed on our labs Rostock Max v3, there are a couple errors.
1. Our hot bed won't get above 82, and even with a cloth on top, not much more than that. I read that it should get up to 100 C, but that doesn't seem possible currently. Is there a way to fix this?

2. When heating up the bed and nozzle, the bed will heat up for a little bit, but the nozzle stays constant. After a little bit, both the bed and the nozzle go Undefined. While reading on the forums, I tried the voltage across the fuse on the heater and the voltage going across while on is >12. Therefore, I thought the heater might be broken. Is this true? I thought it might be the thermister, but the heating block doesn't even get warm when it attempts to heat up.

Anything helps! Thanks

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geneb
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Re: Temp Undefined, possible broken heater for HE280

Postby geneb » Wed Sep 12, 2018 8:15 am

Check the terminal blocks on the RAMBo to make sure you don't have any "cooked" terminals. When you turn the hot end on, check the hot end terminals on the RAMBo to make sure you see 12v there as it heats up.

If you've got a v3 with the single-rail power supply (not ATX), you can bump the output voltage a bit using the adjustment pot next to the terminal block on the power supply. This might get your bed hotter.

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Re: Temp Undefined, possible broken heater for HE280

Postby rootboy » Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:45 pm

I'm with Gene on this one, I'm going to say that you have a loose connection somewhere.


First off, the voltage check that you did on your your heater indicates a blown fuse. The classic way of testing for a blown fuse is to put a voltmeter across the fuse. If it shows voltage, in this case 12 volts, it's a goner.

"I tried the voltage across the fuse on the heater and the voltage going across while on is >12. "


But let's assume that's not the case for the moment. Here's a few suggestions.

1) Check the voltage at the bed and the nozzle. Not at the terminals on the board. This is the best indication of what voltage your heater is receiving. If it's under your source voltage by more than a volt, work your way backwards feeling for warm spots with the heater(s) on. Mind your fingers... :)

2) Has this been working? Is there a chance that you might be trying to run a 24 volt cartridge on 12 volts?

3) How do the MOSFETs look? Any sign that they have been cooked? Look around the MOSFETs for damaged or missing parts (having the gate fire intermittently would cause this). Did you hear something "pop" and then hear something ricochet recently? That would be an unauthorized chip launch...

4) Drive your heaters directly from your power supply (be sure to disconnect them from your board first otherwise you will most likely destroy the board). Do they get up to temp now? Don't leave them this way for any longer than you need to to see the temperatures on your heaters.

5) Do you have a scope? Putting a scope on the heaters will give you an idea as to what the duty cycle is. Short power pulses followed by long off times ain't going to heat things up much. By the same token, sporadic power pulses that come and go with long or intermittent idles times would tend to indicate that something is misfiring at the board level.

6) Try a different power supply for your Max V3.

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Re: Temp Undefined, possible broken heater for HE280

Postby geneb » Thu Sep 13, 2018 8:40 am

...and do NOT test fuses in-circuit. Remove them first. :)

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Re: Temp Undefined, possible broken heater for HE280

Postby rootboy » Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:17 am

Meh, whatever.

Before I was a Controls engineer, I was a Colorado Master electrician. And that's how we did it.

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Re: Temp Undefined, possible broken heater for HE280

Postby geneb » Fri Sep 14, 2018 8:09 am

Well with electronics like the RAMBo, you can get a false "good" check if you test it in circuit, so "meh" yourself.

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Re: Temp Undefined, possible broken heater for HE280

Postby Xenocrates » Fri Sep 14, 2018 3:50 pm

Depends on if you go based on resistance or voltage, as well as your criteria for acceptable versus bad. It's pretty unlikely that you wouldn't have at least a volt of drop across a blown fuse, no matter what sort of leakage you got from other electronics, and anything beyond 100 mV at these low of voltages tells me that the fuse could probably use replaced, even if it isn't opening the circuit.
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Re: Temp Undefined, possible broken heater for HE280

Postby rootboy » Sat Sep 15, 2018 4:15 am

Well yeah, if you have it off while you measure for voltage, it would be a display of a fundamental lack of electrical understanding.

And since one of the things that he is looking for is voltage drop, he's going to need volts and a load. And since he's getting some heat, it's obvious that the fuse would show good resistance-wise, so why check it in the first place?

For what not to do... :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TwIvUbOhcKE


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