V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

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Windshadow
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V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Windshadow » Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:03 pm

I doubt many folks recall my participation here in late 2015 to mid 2016 building and using my V2 but in August of that year I had to put it into storage as I had to go back to work in a job that required constant travel.

I am now back to a settled status and I thought it might be fun to upgrade my V2 to the current V3.2
Has anyone done a detailed list of what is needed for this? I assume that the these parts will be needed
https://www.seemecnc.com/collections/pa ... 300-hotend
https://www.seemecnc.com/collections/pa ... s/whip-kit
https://www.seemecnc.com/collections/pa ... trol-board
https://www.seemecnc.com/collections/pa ... v3-to-v3-2 (does this include the 3 items above at the$380 price point
https://www.seemecnc.com/collections/pa ... t-for-v3-2 at $138

So if that is right about $520 for the needed parts... what am I missing here as I see all the info seems to be about upgrading a V3 to V3.x and where do I look for the needed how to do it posts and videos.
in other words does this V3 to V3.2 set of instructions cover doing a late version V2 to V3.2 upgrade https://seemecnc.dozuki.com/Guide/Upgra ... 95?lang=en

Cheers
Windy
PS: I am at last fully recovered from the broken (c2) neck in July 2016 ( but I had to go back to work to pay all medical bills that it caused

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby PengLord » Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:39 pm

The 3.0 to 3.2 kit includes the Duet, Whip, and hotend.
If you add the panel, you will need to drill some holes or print my side mount adapter: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2986057
The side-panel mount requires longer cables, you can make a longer 4-wire cable using the connectors provided in the DuetWifi box. Further details here: viewtopic.php?f=112&p=108921#p108921

You might want to consider picking up a handful of (4-5) 9 degree steppers ($15 each) since you'll be doing upgrades anyways.

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby geneb » Fri Jul 13, 2018 8:03 am

Windshadow! Nice to see you still kicking around man!

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Xenocrates » Fri Jul 13, 2018 11:05 am

Those instructions won't cover everything. The V2 doesn't have the same frame setup as the V3, nor does it have mounting holes for the Duet, whip, etc. If you want that, you'll need a V3 frame kit, which goes for 270. If you don't want to change the hole frame, you can use a duet mount for the V2 frame, such as mine, which is designed to be laser cut, but can be printed, or Codon's. Mine and Codon's are fairly similar, as far as the actual duet mount, mine just uses larger diameter fans, since I had a handful of 60mm computer fans around. His has a complete paneldue setup however.

You may also want some of the machined ball joints, so that you have a match between the hotend and the carriages

Let us know how it all works out, and welcome back. It's very good to hear your health has returned (even if it does come with a side of having to work).
Machines:
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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Windshadow » Fri Jul 13, 2018 5:12 pm

Thanks Guys its nice to be remembered. :D I am going to be a hale and healthy :D 70 next month and for a time after the injury I wondered if I was going to make it to 68 :o .

I read the guide for the 3 to 3.2 and I noticed that this upgrade involves shifting the steppers up top as well as a bunch of other stuff so this looks to be a bit more expensive than I thought with the laser cut frame stuff.... the new steppers are a minor expense and(those neat machined ball joints I can make myself on my Schaublin instrument makers lathe from either prints or by buying one and copying it) .... basically a full teardown(though I had to do a partial disassembly for storage anyway so the top is separate from the rest and the uprights removed so a lot of that part is done) and rebuild. of course If I have to make a bunch of parts for the upgrade like the duet mount then I will need to get it running again first and make those... lots to think about.
This is the lathe and I made myself a ball turning tool some years ago. :D
Image
https://www.dropbox.com/s/fz8cnoj4gsnou4e/Schaublin%20ft.%20view_preview.jpg?dl=0
looks like I have forgotten how to include an image here as well :?
So I will need to sit down this weekend and see exactly what I will need but I thing it is essentially a full rebuild and if I have to get a set of the new laser cut frames then I think doing it with those following the guide for the 3.2 using parts from the old machine as well so I am guessing about 7oo to900 bucks outlay so it may be a month or 2 till I start (other finishing the disassembly.) a saving of 100 to 150 over ordering a new kit and rebuilding the V2 to its v2 level and trying to craigs list it... used 3d printers built from kits don't have much resale value here :cry:with the difference so small it might make more sense to spend the $1000 for a new v3.2 kit and I bet with moving the steppers a lot of wiring will need to be replaced...( I hate splicing wiring for length... it has come back and bitten me more than once on boat electronics.)

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Xenocrates » Sat Jul 14, 2018 12:03 pm

Likely with the V3 to V3.2 upgrade kit, and the designs from repables, you'll have a pretty darn solid machine. The V3 frame is quite nice, but the V2 is still pretty solid (after all, a bunch of us manage to make pretty good parts on V2s, and Gene and a few others still keep V1's in working trim (I've fixed one, but don't own one)). A large portion of the V3 improvements are in assembly, and some ergonomics for things like belt tensioning, as well as board mounting. There's more rigidity in the bed mounting solution, but I'm not sure that's exactly needed as it stands, for a duet based platform, as it was aimed at generating a clean sharp tap for the V3's accelerometer system.
Machines:
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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Windshadow » Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:31 pm

So the duet wyfi upgrade kit can be used with the computer and steppers on the lower deck? that would mean
https://www.seemecnc.com/collections/pa ... v3-to-v3-2
and
https://www.seemecnc.com/collections/pa ... t-for-v3-2
and the 3 replacement steppers at $15 is that change to .9 degree stepper needed by the upgrade to use the new controller and hotend to best effect....

if I want to move the stuff up top, it looks a bit like I could drill the needed mounting holes in the existing top and print the 3 needed taller top side pieces and save the cost of the v3 frame kit

or keep the gear in the base... roughly $550 ... thats better on the outlay front and it wont have as much rewiring, but I will need to make a custom longer whip Right? to keep the controller in the base... or I need to move the steppers and controller to the top as above... have folks taken this upgrade path?

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Xenocrates » Sun Jul 15, 2018 12:25 pm

I've taken something close to it, with having a duet in the bottom of a v2 frame. The .9 motors aren't needed to make it work really well, but they do give better resolution, and unlike the stock controller, the duet can run at a step rate to fully make use of the .9 motors. What you may want to do is put a terminal block up in the top of the printer (I have a few in mine, honestly, because I like to tweak the wiring occasionally), and have the majority of the original wiring run to the terminal block, and then the whip connected to that, while the wiring for the strain gauge and possibly some other stuff can run in a variety of spots. Some people have put it in the slots on the towers, under covers, I have mine running in a cable duct on the side of my printer, etc.

As far as I know, no one has moved the steppers and controller on a V2 up top, partially because the motor mounts and tower brackets are very different between the V2 and V3, as the v3 uses injection molded parts with the geometry setup for motors either top or bottom.
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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Windshadow » Sun Jul 15, 2018 9:35 pm

Thanks Xeno, I like your thinking on that... the use of terminal blocks up top sounds like a smart way to do it....
Time to start sketching out how I want to do it...
Thinking if i swap the steppers I could use the old rambo and steppers to build a Prusa, printing the parts on my v2/2.8 :) might be handy to also have a printer of the other type... if it turns out well I could give it to the local boys and girls club... the Prusa design seems to be the favored design in beginning 3d education.... I I think they have a pair of Dremel printer they got via a grant last year

I can make your mount out of some scrap solid surfacing that is left over from a bathroom remodel .25 thick it is a faux corian if I remember right The nice thing about having a machine shop with lathes and a bridgeport mill etc is that I am not limited to printing needed parts sometimes old fashioned shop work is quicker :shock:

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby ramai » Tue Jul 17, 2018 3:12 pm

Hey I remember you too windy, I've been kicking around here for a while. Welcome back. I have the V2 as well, and recently upgraded it to the Duet and added the upgraded power supply from Seeme.

I decided not to upgrade the frame or move anything to the top since I didn't see big benefits to doing that. But the Duet looked like a very worthwhile upgrade. I really enjoy the web interface so far. I opted not to do the panelDue so there is no onboard interface for the printer now since the old lcd is not compatible.

The upgraded power supply will make your machine run a bit louder since you need more cooling now for the extra power. The heated bed heats 30% faster though, and it can go higher.

The SE300 hotend from Seeme looks really nice. I'm considering that one. It includes a strain gauge which will take care of the auto calibration by pressing the head lightly on the bed. Looks pretty sweet!
Rostock MAX V2 with trick trucks, cf arms, prometheus hot end, nimble extruder, berdAir cooling.
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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Windshadow » Wed Jul 18, 2018 4:26 pm

Thanks Ramai, I got my kit for the v2 at the start of December 2016 and so it has the flat type of power supply in the shiny metal case not the computer power supply of the ATX type that the early kits had so I hope I am ok there...
I just need to double check to see if is of the 12 volt and 29 amp size I guess it will be the one they still sell bellow and the text there seems to indicate it is the one shipped with the later v2 and I would guess the v3.
https://www.seemecnc.com/collections/pa ... wer-supply
as I also see one for $70
https://www.seemecnc.com/collections/pa ... supply-kit

the pictures are the same for both of them so I guess the extra $21 is for the wiring, hardware and swap instructions

The royal PITA that i had (other than having to recalibrate every time I moved my v2 from one bench to the other one)( so the new hotend sensor SE300 is very attractive to me.)...were the limit micro switches on each tower (I had lots of problems and replaced them twice the last time right before it went into storage when I had my accident)so I don't know if the that is on then now fixed it the problem was mechanical with the thin metal flappers coming loose.
It looks like they are still in use on the v3 so I guess my problem was an isolated one

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Xenocrates » Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:55 am

IIRC, the V3 has you remove the flaps, and has it lined up such that they endstop screws hit the actuator directly. I've only had a little hands on time with a V3 though, so i'm not entirely sure. You could also use optical endstops. I think it shouldn't break them often though. Mine have managed to last a few years now without replacement.
Machines:
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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Windshadow » Thu Aug 16, 2018 8:28 pm

What happened to all the traffic on this board? It feels like nothing but cricket noises around here compared to the way it was 2 years ago..

Did every one take off for a board that has become the new hotness? and if so why did no one tell me?(is it my breath?)

SeeMeCNC seems to have stoped using youTube as well

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Mac The Knife » Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:56 am

They have all appeared to flock to facebook,,,,,, Not a very good repository for specific problems and solutions.
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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby DeltaCon » Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:19 am

Yes, The facegroup is pretty busy, but it hardly suitable for support. Most people seem to be too lazy to visit fora anymore.
Maybe it is cursing in church, but I am afraid a lot of the early SeeMe enthusiasts took off to other brands too...
I am DeltaCon, I have a delta, my name is Con, I am definitely PRO delta! ;-)
Rostock V2 / E3D V6 / Raymond Style Heatchamber on the way!

PS.: Sorry for the avatar, that's my other hobby!

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Xenocrates » Fri Aug 17, 2018 1:30 pm

I suspect it's a combination of the facebook group, less interest in enthusiast 3D printing (trends indicate that consumer, meaning plug and play, and industrial, are both up quite a bit), and a series of new models pushing older folks out of the forum. After all, despite there being numerous V1's out in the wild, I've seen posts about maybe three owners in the past two(ish?) years (Geneb, who has everything, Proto, who I repaired one for, and IIRC, Mike has one too), and losing some of our major cheerleaders who encouraged posting (Mike, who went to his own blog, Eaglesoar, who passed away), and other folks wondering away to make successful products/business's, and other similar real life interference (Generic Default, Travelphotog, etc.)

And I do think there is an element of people leaving for either other brands or homebrewing machines, since the advantages the Delta and the Rostock max design offer over other platforms to compensate for the calibration have been pared down by commodification, iteration, and volume manufacturing.

I still tend to trawl this board a few times a day, but don't post much (I have been dealing with the other sides of my hobbies, and I don't feel right posting projects that haven't been touched by a CNC, while my few CNC projects are all for clients, and thus I don't feel right posting those without explicit permission, but I may have a cool looking one soon I can post)
Machines:
Rostock Max V2, Duet .8.5, PT100 enabled E3D V6 and volcano, Raymond style enclosure
Automation Technology 60W laser cutter/engraver
1m X-carve router

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Windshadow » Sun Aug 26, 2018 9:01 pm

I never thought of looking at facebook as I don't use either facebook or twitter... I still am active on a home shop machinest email list that has been going since the days of compuservee so I guess I am a bit of a fossil.
I can understand the attraction of a printer you take out of its box install a sd card with your files on it, hit print and have perfect prints first time every time, but I got involved with V2 as a hobby to learn how 3d printing worked as a part of my continuing education... at 70 now I have come to think that when you stop learning new things you start the long slide into the rest home and death and i am far to curious about the future to start ossifying at this time.

thanks for the info
Windy

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Windshadow » Wed Aug 29, 2018 1:49 pm

At the moment i am up to my armpits in recommissioning my home Machine shop and I expect a few more weeks doing that (moving everything around in order to epoxy paint the concrete floor in stages is a major deal working alone (as things like the Bridgeport milling machine and my Large 12 x36 engine lathe are heavy and a bit top heavy)

Then I will put together a final shopping list of what I need to buy from SeeMeCNC to make this upgrade.... with the costs so high; as well as the option of selling the old V2 (once I reassemble and get it working) and buying the V3.2 kit there is the option of getting the nice shiny ARTEMIS 300 ARP™ KIT at $2,000 (plus the $200 for the Touch screen.... if I could get the old V2 into shape to sell for a grand I guess I can swing that... I just doubt there is a market in rural Maine for the used V2.

It is very comforting to see you guys still here to give help and advice as its a bit frightening how much i have forgotten about the V2 in the ensuing 2 years.

Cheers
Windy

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby geneb » Thu Aug 30, 2018 8:39 am

It's like riding a bike, you never /really/ forget. ;)

g.
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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Windshadow » Sun Sep 02, 2018 5:02 pm

Gene, add about 30 years to your current total (guessing you are about 30 something?) and we will see how much you have left of short term memory! :o I hope your luck in this area is better than mine! I just hit 70 last week and I admit I are starting to really feel my age

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby geneb » Mon Sep 03, 2018 11:32 am

You're only 20 years ahead of me. After all the chemo I had in 2011 & 2012, I've got a mind like a steel trap and a memory like a steel sieve. ;)

g.
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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Xenocrates » Mon Sep 03, 2018 4:13 pm

geneb wrote:I've got a mind like a steel trap

g.


Rusty and illegal in a few states? :lol:

No matter how you two feel age or illness has affected your minds, I would say you're both pretty sharp, and that even young'uns like myself have more than occasional moments of forgetting random things.
Machines:
Rostock Max V2, Duet .8.5, PT100 enabled E3D V6 and volcano, Raymond style enclosure
Automation Technology 60W laser cutter/engraver
1m X-carve router

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Re: V2 (mid 2016) to V3.2 (current) upgrade?

Postby Windshadow » Fri Sep 14, 2018 3:09 pm

Thanks Xeno, :)
Right now I am deep into reconfiguring my (manual) machine tool workshop and getting it all working again in its new location (Heated and air-conditioned) and while its mostly small machines (by industrial machine tool standards) it is a lot tougher to shift bout than it was 20 years ago the last time I moved it... one problem is that the PosiTip 850 is now so old that getting repair parts is a bit of a PITA and it is the newer gear in the shop by about 40 years!... so upgrading the V2 project is on hold for a while....

I also Just won an Auction for a Original Prusa Kit at about half of the current going price (under $500) and its the i3 MK3.... it was a fund raiser for my local gun club's fall event; (donated by a recent widow whose husband had bought it shortly before his unexpected death in an accident along with all of his reloading equipment and firearms.. it was a big success and the club payed off the mortgage 3 years early)... unopened in its original box and only 2 months old....

So It will become my next project after moving the shop and I will then have a way of printing any thing I need to upgrade my V2 to V3.2 that way I don't have to reassemble my V2 now partly disassembled for storage... and then take it all apart again for its upgrade... also this will be my first whack at a non delta printer and it will be fun to learn the different sort of printer... Guessing it will be winter before I start my MAX V2 to V3.2 upgrade

This is the major stuff from my shop:
Bridgeport Milling Machine with Heidenhan PosiTip 855 DRO
Schaublin 102 Instrument Makers Lathe 102mm x 470mm
Atlas 12 x 36 Quick Change Engine Lathe with Tool Post Grinder
AMMCO 7" Metal Shaper
Delta 14" Floor Drill Press
Heat Treating Oven 7" x 7" x 11"
Mitsubishi Electric FREQROL Variable Speed Control for each of the 3 phase machines for great speed control.


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