Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

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Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Wed Oct 19, 2016 5:55 am

Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3.

Hi, i have switched to HE280, new power supply, new ezrstruder, new ballmount arms, new cheapskates and everything electronic/hardware is proper connected and is alive.

-Still i have super trouble using auto probe calibration script, first time i run it it just kept looping over and over and didnt stop or save what was done. The next time i tried it, it did stop but calibration was way off and when i tried a 20mm box print the ezrstruder just keeps making skipping noises and jumps a bit every second or so when i try to print and the print is not on the plate.

When i tried calibrating again the HE280 head just smashed into the Z axis and got stuck making super loud "i want to kill myself noises" until i ran over and did power off...

Why cant this stuff just work ?

Technical information: I Run Matter control version 1.5.0 on windows 10.
Firmware i got from here: https://github.com/seemecnc/Firmware (15 october 2016)

I have attached a dropbox version of my repertier file (maybe i did something wrong there?) if anyone of you would like to review it.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/rvomimw9gqkr ... C7aRa?dl=0

Edited the repertier.ino file in arduino ide (version 1.6.8) so y axis was inverted and in configuration.h i did these additional changes.

//############################# Define your motherboard here! #################################
// 301 = RAMBo 302 = MINI RAMBo
#define MOTHERBOARD 301
// ########### Rostock MAX v3 = 5 #######################################################
#define PRINTER 5
// 1 = ATX on older machines 2 = Rail style PSU on newer machines ############################
#define POWER_SUPPLY 2


FYI
-Y axis was inverted the first time around so i had to run to the power switch again when it homed.
Fixed it in Arduino IDE. Documentation was nowhere to be found!

I dont know how to fix this anymore. The experience from going from v2 to v3 has been so frustrating and with lack of proper documentation on the web and all the tutorials is hidden away under different part productpages on the website, the psu upgrade isnt even there anymore, answers from support has been no good, all messages i leave in orders when i buy stuff is disregarded and not answered.

This has been a pain in the ass. If any of you think of upgrading the v2 to v3, just go buy another 3d printer instead.... Im definitely not impressed.

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby morgandc » Wed Oct 19, 2016 7:37 am

I am sure you have already tried he following, but worth mentioning
    Square up your towers with a square
    adjust your tower endstops offsets using the firmware/endstop screws
    customize your xyz probe points to match mhackney's recommendations to help avoid hot end "tilt"
    make sure you hot end is not active when probing.
I don't have anything magic to add as I am a newb to both 3d printing and the seemecnc line of printers, but this is what comes to mind after living in the forums the last few weeks.

If you manually calibrate can you lay down a good first layer test print?

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby morgandc » Wed Oct 19, 2016 7:39 am

Also, I am curious why you upgraded from v2 to v3? What were you looking to gain?

Thanks,
-Dwight

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby geneb » Wed Oct 19, 2016 7:58 am

Make sure you calibrate with the hot end cold.

Make sure the cable connector isn't coming loose from the hot end - if the bowden exit is too close to the hot end, it can pull the connector loose when it stretches out a bit.

g.
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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Wed Oct 19, 2016 8:02 am

I will get back on the other stuff you suggested.

The reason for upgrading anything was that the old Extruder got fried when i used octopi a while ago, so i had do order a new one.
Then the ATX power supply stopped working, so i had do upgrade that.

When extruder number two failed, i had hopes that the new design 280 was better so i ordered that.

Then when i got it that didnt fit the old arms i had so i had to buy new arms, but to mount the arms i needed new skates....
And thats why its now almost an entirely new upgrade.

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guanu
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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby guanu » Wed Oct 19, 2016 10:52 am

did you upgrade the frame as well? if not, there is a difference between the floating and the rigid mounting of the heated bed... you have v3 set in your firmware, but if you still are using the v2 frame, you need to select v2 in the firmware because you still have a v2, just with the current hotend and motion system.

Guanu

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Wed Oct 19, 2016 3:52 pm

Aha! Thank you! Do you know what printer number the v2 is in the repetier configuration.h ?

It only says that rostock max is number 5 on v3. not what v2 is

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby guanu » Thu Oct 20, 2016 2:01 pm

if you are using current firmware, it is listed around billions of stars right on the top of configuration.h...

Code: Select all

// ############################################################################################
//############################# Define your motherboard here! #################################
// ############################################################################################
// 301 = RAMBo    302 = MINI RAMBo
#define MOTHERBOARD 301

// ############################################################################################
//########################### Define your Printer Model here! #################################
// ############################################################################################
// ###########   Orion = 1
// ###########   Rostock Max V2 = 2
// ###########   ERIS = 3
// ###########   DROPLIT = 4
// ###########   Rostock MAX v3 = 5
#define PRINTER 5

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Sat Oct 22, 2016 7:23 am

Great! Didnt know how i missed that. Thank you.

Still havent found a solution for properly connecting the he280 connector and make sure it doesnt fall out during print or calibration.
I tried with zip-ties around one of the extruder legs, but that only keeps it half in place.

Anybody found a good solution for mounting the plug yet

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby morgandc » Sat Oct 22, 2016 7:54 am

I zip tied my connector wire to the bowden tube which is stiffer to reduce some of the load on the connecter up several inches.

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Sun Oct 23, 2016 8:00 am

I made a zip tie mount in the plastics below the plug by gently drilling a tiny hole for a zip tie and that seemed to work fine.

Still new problems pop up. Now the he280 will not heat up when i choose heat or preheat.
After some time i get the def message.

I have double checked all the wiring with a multimeter, all connections are good.
The termistor reads about 108kohm when the connector is disconnected so that should be working fine, i also doublechecked this with holding a soldering iron to the metal on the extruder head to see it responding to heat changes and all is good there.

Still the extruder never heats up. Also double checked the wiring for the heater.
Can this be a firmware bug? Cant find any wrong cabling, or loose solders or broken termistor...

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Sun Oct 23, 2016 8:02 am

attached a screenshot of repetier host and the termistor reads the temperature right.
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2016-10-23 14_01_06-Program Manager.png

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Sun Oct 23, 2016 8:04 am

After some time trying to preheat, the error message is the default one
Attachments
2016-10-23 14_03_35-Repetier-Host V1.6.2.png
2016-10-23 14_03_35-Repetier-Host V1.6.2.png (11.06 KiB) Viewed 2622 times

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby morgandc » Sun Oct 23, 2016 8:44 am

If I am reading that right, after 46 seconds it shut off due to the thermistor reading room temp. 46 seconds is long enough for you to either measure some heat coming off the heater cartridge or feel it with the back of your hand (without touching it) if the cartridge is actually heating.

Do you feel any heat?
Does the preheat command from the LCD panel do the same thing?

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Sun Oct 23, 2016 8:50 am

Yes, same thing from the lcd panel and repetier.

No heat coming from the heater. Checked it a bunch of times.
The red led light turns on both on the rambo board and the he280 when the extruder should be warming up, so there is no bad connections on the cables going to the extruder. Also doublechecked that all the way from the rambo to the connector.

When i turn everything off, disconect the extruder and do a multimeter connection test on the two poles on the heater there apparently is a short, as the beeper on the multimeter goes off.

How can i measure if the heater itself is broken?

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Sun Oct 23, 2016 9:03 am

For the record, here is my solution to the connector for the HE280.

The HE280 was made with a big fault, no connector with screws or any other way of securing it to the extruder. A moving head will always put stress on the connector over time.

I removed the cable shrimp, and put a new one on the connector with two strips inside. Those strips will be connected to other strips that are mounted directly to the extruder legs. See pictures.

I drilled a tiny hole in one of the plastic legs to be able to have a mount where the fan is on the backside of the leg, and putting the strip around will not work.
Attachments
Bilde 23.10.2016, 14.29.19.jpg
Bilde 23.10.2016, 14.27.29.jpg
Bilde 23.10.2016, 14.28.41.jpg

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby morgandc » Sun Oct 23, 2016 9:18 am

Warning: This is getting deeper than I have personally played with on the HE280, I assembled mine, but have not done any troubleshooting so this is theoretical knowledge, not hands on tested :D

I believe the red light only indicates that the printer is logically trying to heat, it is not a measurement of voltage to the heat cartridge. I saw a post where you can turn the lights on with a g code. I would look for a point to measure the voltage on the largest red/black wires on the HE280 board if there is a place and verify 12v. If you pop the plastic cover off, you can easily get to the solder points.
http://seemecnc.dozuki.com/Guide/Step+1+-+HE280+Assembly/45 to identify where the wires where soldered for the cartridge.

According to the following post http://forum.seemecnc.com/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=10616&p=94238&hilit=Heater+Cartridge+ohms#p94238 you should be able to measure 4 ohms across a disconnected heat cartridge if you need to go that far.

1. Check that voltage is being supplied to the hot end.
2. Test the resistance across the heat cartridge, should be around 4 ohms. I think you will have to unsolder one of the leads to do this.
3. If the heat cartridge tests good, put an amp meter inline with the heat cartridge lead that you disconnected and measure the amperage provided to the cartridge. This will tell you if the Rambo is putting out enough power. (40watt cartridge @ 12v =? 40/12= 3.3 amps. So you should be seeing at least a couple of amps during a heat cycle. Make sure your amp meter can handle a couple of amps and not blow a fuse.

Needless to say, be very careful not to short anything out with the covers off or you will let the smoke out. Also, all of the standard soldering disclaimers.
Last edited by morgandc on Sun Oct 23, 2016 9:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Sun Oct 23, 2016 9:24 am

Good idea, i measured 11.4V DC over the solder leads on the board to the heater when it was on.

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Sun Oct 23, 2016 9:32 am

Is it the same heater cartridge for the old extruder as the new one? I have a spare kit from the old one laying around

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby morgandc » Sun Oct 23, 2016 9:36 am

Doesn't look like they are the same. I think they switched from a 6.8 ohm Heating resister to a Heating cartridge looking at their web page and combined with reading the post I linked earlier.

https://www.seemecnc.com/collections/parts-accessories/products/6-8-ohm-heating-resistor
vs.
https://www.seemecnc.com/collections/parts-accessories/products/12v-40-watt-heater-cartridge-6mm-od-x-15mm-long-w-20mm-lead-wire

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby geneb » Sun Oct 23, 2016 10:52 am

If you're seeing power at the points where the heater cartridge lines solder to the PCB, then you've either got a wiring problem, the thermal fuse has failed, or the heater cartridge has failed.

g.
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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby morgandc » Sun Oct 23, 2016 11:17 am

Geneb can you clarify the design? The assumption I was going with is that there would be voltage across the heating cartridge as it has resistance and to be heating it had to have current.

Thanks,
-Dwight

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Sun Oct 23, 2016 12:57 pm

Where can i see if the thermal fuse is out?

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Sun Oct 23, 2016 3:03 pm

so i took the extruder apart and searched and measured.

the heater is 4 ohms, all leads are properly connected and there is a signal all the way from the rambo to the heater.

i have triple checked the two small smd fuses, and the one big 15amp fuse on the rambo.
They are working. Everything should work. Im out of ideas.

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Re: Trouble upgrading rostock max V2 to V3

Postby subsoniq » Sun Oct 23, 2016 3:13 pm

is there anything in the repetier code that should be changed with define printer 2 (rostock max v2) and the new he280 hotend?


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