Titled prints

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LASERMAN
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Re: Titled prints

Post by LASERMAN » Sun Jul 20, 2014 2:36 pm

I reloaded the repitier firmware and even re-loaded the configuration.h

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Re: Titled prints

Post by Polygonhell » Sun Jul 20, 2014 3:01 pm

If your sure it's not mechanical, I.e. The xAxis feels like the other two when moved by hand, there are two things further to try.
The first is opening the electronics door and running a fan over the I RAMBO board while printing.
The second is while doing the first raise the current by say 20 on the steppers, the current values are in configuration.h, they are not in the EEPROM.

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Re: Titled prints

Post by LASERMAN » Sun Jul 20, 2014 7:37 pm

Polygonhell wrote:If your sure it's not mechanical, I.e. The xAxis feels like the other two when moved by hand, there are two things further to try.
The first is opening the electronics door and running a fan over the I RAMBO board while printing.
The second is while doing the first raise the current by say 20 on the steppers, the current values are in configuration.h, they are not in the EEPROM.


From all the swapping I have done, it shouldn't be ANYTHING :shock:

I have a fan on the Rambo board - it's the loudest part of the machine.

I tried increasing the current on the steppers - it didn't seem to help - just made the steppers run hotter.

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Re: Titled prints

Post by dtgriscom » Sun Jul 20, 2014 8:45 pm

LASERMAN wrote:I tried increasing the current on the steppers - it didn't seem to help - just made the steppers run hotter.


Try the reverse: cut the current a bit and see if the problem gets worse. Don't just cut the current on the X stepper, cut them all. Either you'll start losing steps on all of them, or the one will get worse. If they all start losing steps at the same time then you've found yet another thing that isn't the problem. But, if the tilting gets much worse, then you've figured out how to make the problem happen more often. That means you have an enormous hint on how to make it better. At the least, you'll be able to replicate the problem much more quickly.


Dan

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Re: Titled prints

Post by LASERMAN » Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:00 am

If it were the steppers, or the drivers, it would have switched towers when I swapped the motors or the plugs on the card, no?

Only two things remain that have not been swapped: the tower itself, and the tricklaser arms.
I'm going to try swapping the arms around tonight. I actually have some extra 80/20 extrusion, so I might do that as well.

AT this point I welcome ALL suggestions - I'm stumped.

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Re: Titled prints

Post by dtgriscom » Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:09 am

LASERMAN wrote:If it were the steppers, or the drivers, it would have switched towers when I swapped the motors or the plugs on the card, no?

True, but the fact is that somehow the X tower is different from the Y and Z. That the difference is relatively subtle makes your debugging job harder. If you make the difference obvious then you'll get much quicker feedback on what causes or fixes the problem.

So, I'd suggest trying things that might make the problem worse:

- cut the stepper current

- increase the acceleration value

- add weight to the effector platform

- add weight to all three Cheapskates

-

Again, make sure that what you do is symmetrical, so that any asymmetry will be due to your original problem rather than a new one.


Keep us updated,
Dan

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Re: Titled prints

Post by LASERMAN » Mon Jul 28, 2014 1:24 pm

UPDATE: This is getting ridiculous...

I made a new effector platform and put it on the machine to make sure there was no slop. While I was at it, I rotated the Tricklaser arms so they weren't on the same tower as before.

The thing still puts out tilted prints, and still in the same direction. Increasing the speed makes it worse. Adjusting the stepper current seems to make no difference.

The only thing I have not replaced or swapped is the tower itself. I have used an inclinometer to check the tower at both top and bottom - it seems straight.

I am running out of patience with this machine. I printed the new effector using a printer that was 20 minutes out of the box.

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Re: Titled prints

Post by geneb » Tue Jul 29, 2014 9:27 am

Another thing you might want to check is the bearings that the belt rolls on. If one is frozen, this might create enough drag to cause the problem you're seeing.

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Re: Titled prints

Post by DocHogan » Sat Aug 02, 2014 8:58 am

Just a complete WAG, as I don't remember what's gone before, so YMMV.

Have you swapped locations of stepper motors at all? As the slew is always the same vector, is there any chance that you simply have an underperforming stepper motor at one axis?

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Re: Titled prints

Post by LASERMAN » Mon Aug 04, 2014 5:59 pm

DocHogan wrote:Just a complete WAG, as I don't remember what's gone before, so YMMV.

Have you swapped locations of stepper motors at all? As the slew is always the same vector, is there any chance that you simply have an underperforming stepper motor at one axis?


Yes I did. I covered my first round troubleshooting on page two. Then I swapped plugs to the Rambo. This should have ruled out both the steppers and the Rambo card.

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Re: Titled prints

Post by 626Pilot » Tue Aug 05, 2014 12:35 am

I saw a slant exactly like this while trying different fixes for Z=0 near the edge. It happened because I put in a value for one of the Delta Radius A/B/C values. When I reverted the value to 0, the slant went away.

For troubleshooting purposes, verify that Delta Radius A/B/C are all zero. If they are, try printing your test cube with Delta Radius A (A, B, and C refer to the X, Y, and Z towers) set to 0.5 and another test at -0.5. What happens? If it makes the slant better or worse, you may be able to converge on the correct value through incremental testing.

Also, if you plug the X stepper into Y, Y into Z and Z into X, would that still work but rotate the coordinate system by 120 degrees? If so, doing that might be another test to validate that your stepper driver isn't hosed.

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Re: Titled prints

Post by LASERMAN » Tue Aug 05, 2014 9:28 am

The swapping of plugs, like you suggest, is an excellent way to determine if it is the motor or the board. I did that, and the problem stayed in the same axis.

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Re: Titled prints

Post by geneb » Tue Aug 05, 2014 9:36 am

At this point the only thing that's really left is a mechanical drag issue or a firmware/EEPROM issue.

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Re: Titled prints

Post by LASERMAN » Wed Sep 17, 2014 2:31 pm

UPDATE: I have been letting the printer sit, because I just didn't have anything left to check. I recently noticed that the top had become loose, and the top had dropped on the side of the suspect tower. I believe this is what was causing the tilt. I have run a few jobs at normal speed without the tilt appearing. I was storing a couple of reels of material up there to provide some weight to stabilize it. It slid down about an inch or so on one side.

So now I will start using it again. I also have a couple of "other" printers, so I have been able to keep doing jobs to support my habit. I like to use the Max for vases (always makes great gifts!) , and I was starting to go big on things like the Moai and the sharks tooth on Thingiverse. Before I had this issue I made a South Park Cartman figure over 12" tall. I made him hollow, so he makes a great quarter bank.

Thanks for all the ideas and support from everyone while I was having this issue.

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