Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby elqisqeyano » Thu May 02, 2013 5:50 pm

xnaron wrote:
cambo3d wrote:great job guys, another mod on my to do list, actually i think im gonna use this on my second build instead.

where are the files at for the 3d printed parts.

flateric what did you end up using for your magnetic mount idea?


I haven't released the files yet. I gave flateric a copy of them so he could have a sneak peak. I'm writing up a blog post for this along with some videos. I'm currently looking at sourcing some components such as carbon fiber tubes and I may put a kit together for these. I'll keep you guys posted.

thanks,
Brendin



We are all anxiously awaiting for the files. I noticed you using Carbon fiber tubes from arrows. That would be a great alternative to printing the arms, then all we need are the files for the ends. Arrow carbon fibers tubes are incredibly strong, flexible and true.

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby cambo3d » Thu May 02, 2013 7:18 pm

xnaron wrote:
cambo3d wrote:great job guys, another mod on my to do list, actually i think im gonna use this on my second build instead.

where are the files at for the 3d printed parts.

flateric what did you end up using for your magnetic mount idea?


I haven't released the files yet. I gave flateric a copy of them so he could have a sneak peak. I'm writing up a blog post for this along with some videos. I'm currently looking at sourcing some components such as carbon fiber tubes and I may put a kit together for these. I'll keep you guys posted.

thanks,
Brendin



thanks brendin,

I was prototyping an aluminum mount for the magnet joints but kit would save me the trouble of making it. Let me know when these are available. A complete plug-n-play kit would be great.

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Flateric » Fri May 03, 2013 12:24 am

Here's a few more pics of the setup.

I went with crossbow bolts for my arms. I used nylon cup'd inserts from the bulk nut and bolt bins from Home Depot. They offered exactly the same inner cup diameter and size as the prints and the out diameter also match the magnets perfectly. The magnets also match the crossbow bolt diameter perfectly.

To mount the whole works up to the arm itself I got some of the heat shrink tubing that has an adhesive inside it that liquifies when you are heat shrinking the tubes. This glued the nylon cup ontop of the magnet and the magnet to the shaft of the crossbow bolt. The entire assembly from center pivot point (the center of the ball that the boom end pivots on) to the other ends pivot point is 269mm exactly. The heat shrink tube also aligned and centered up everything nicely when I did the heating, so that was also a nice benefit.

I choose the nylon cups because I happened to notice them strickly by chance when I was there shopping today for some stainless. I don't know what they are originally intended for but I like the fact that this way I have perfect consistency throughout all my boom ends and removed my own possible "screwing the printed ones up" from the equation. A personal choice nothing more. I have used Xnaron's included printable boom ends and they also work perfectly as well.

Here are some pics of the various parts mounted up. Notes the crossbow bolt fins still intact! This is.....ummm. so that they move the air around and assist cooling, ya that's it, that's what they do! I just left them attached as a little joke really nothing more.

Some new observations I have about this mod is. You can literally crank your speed up to much higher levels than you might guess with absolutely no slop or effect on the quality of the print and surface finish. Provided of course you compensate with adjusted heat and extrusion adjustments for the higher speeds. But mechanically it's rock solid and an excellent upgrade.

Xnaron is polishing up the files and triple checking everything to be sure it is "just right" and they should be available this week or weekend I am told. But don't hesitate to get his kit he plans to offer or order up all the bits and print em yourself.

The quality in person is really stunning. I can't express how impressed you'll be with it.

Also the magnets he recommends are plenty strong enough and even with my dual hotend tests so far the carriage has no chance of coming loose even at speeds and jerks that no sane person could or ever would print at.

P1110326_sized.jpg

P1110329_sized.jpg

P1110331_sized.jpg

P1110333.JPG
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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby ApacheXMD » Fri May 03, 2013 1:11 am

Flateric wrote:Here's a few more pics of the setup.

I went with crossbow bolts for my arms. I used nylon cup'd inserts from the bulk nut and bolt bins from Home Depot. They offered exactly the same inner cup diameter and size as the prints and the out diameter also match the magnets perfectly. The magnets also match the crossbow bolt diameter perfectly.


Do you have pictures of just the parts you used? I'm having trouble visualizing the assembly.

Flateric wrote:Some new observations I have about this mod is. You can literally crank your speed up to much higher levels than you might guess with absolutely no slop or effect on the quality of the print and surface finish. Provided of course you compensate with adjusted heat and extrusion adjustments for the higher speeds. But mechanically it's rock solid and an excellent upgrade.


Can you be more specific regarding speeds? Are we talking 200? 300? 400mm/s?

I look forward to the big reveal of the files!

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby elqisqeyano » Fri May 03, 2013 9:26 am

Flateric wrote:Here's a few more pics of the setup.

I went with crossbow bolts for my arms. I used nylon cup'd inserts from the bulk nut and bolt bins from Home Depot. They offered exactly the same inner cup diameter and size as the prints and the out diameter also match the magnets perfectly. The magnets also match the crossbow bolt diameter perfectly.

To mount the whole works up to the arm itself I got some of the heat shrink tubing that has an adhesive inside it that liquifies when you are heat shrinking the tubes. This glued the nylon cup ontop of the magnet and the magnet to the shaft of the crossbow bolt. The entire assembly from center pivot point (the center of the ball that the boom end pivots on) to the other ends pivot point is 269mm exactly. The heat shrink tube also aligned and centered up everything nicely when I did the heating, so that was also a nice benefit.

I choose the nylon cups because I happened to notice them strickly by chance when I was there shopping today for some stainless. I don't know what they are originally intended for but I like the fact that this way I have perfect consistency throughout all my boom ends and removed my own possible "screwing the printed ones up" from the equation. A personal choice nothing more. I have used Xnaron's included printable boom ends and they also work perfectly as well.

Here are some pics of the various parts mounted up. Notes the crossbow bolt fins still intact! This is.....ummm. so that they move the air around and assist cooling, ya that's it, that's what they do! I just left them attached as a little joke really nothing more.

Some new observations I have about this mod is. You can literally crank your speed up to much higher levels than you might guess with absolutely no slop or effect on the quality of the print and surface finish. Provided of course you compensate with adjusted heat and extrusion adjustments for the higher speeds. But mechanically it's rock solid and an excellent upgrade.

Xnaron is polishing up the files and triple checking everything to be sure it is "just right" and they should be available this week or weekend I am told. But don't hesitate to get his kit he plans to offer or order up all the bits and print em yourself.

The quality in person is really stunning. I can't express how impressed you'll be with it.

Also the magnets he recommends are plenty strong enough and even with my dual hotend tests so far the carriage has no chance of coming loose even at speeds and jerks that no sane person could or ever would print at.

P1110326_sized.jpg

P1110329_sized.jpg

P1110331_sized.jpg

P1110333.JPG


Did you have to drill out a hole onto the Chrome steel balls? Or did you just JB Weld them onto the screw?

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby elqisqeyano » Fri May 03, 2013 9:47 am

Flateric wrote:Here's a few more pics of the setup.

I went with crossbow bolts for my arms. I used nylon cup'd inserts from the bulk nut and bolt bins from Home Depot. They offered exactly the same inner cup diameter and size as the prints and the out diameter also match the magnets perfectly. The magnets also match the crossbow bolt diameter perfectly.

To mount the whole works up to the arm itself I got some of the heat shrink tubing that has an adhesive inside it that liquifies when you are heat shrinking the tubes. This glued the nylon cup ontop of the magnet and the magnet to the shaft of the crossbow bolt. The entire assembly from center pivot point (the center of the ball that the boom end pivots on) to the other ends pivot point is 269mm exactly. The heat shrink tube also aligned and centered up everything nicely when I did the heating, so that was also a nice benefit.

I choose the nylon cups because I happened to notice them strickly by chance when I was there shopping today for some stainless. I don't know what they are originally intended for but I like the fact that this way I have perfect consistency throughout all my boom ends and removed my own possible "screwing the printed ones up" from the equation. A personal choice nothing more. I have used Xnaron's included printable boom ends and they also work perfectly as well.

Here are some pics of the various parts mounted up. Notes the crossbow bolt fins still intact! This is.....ummm. so that they move the air around and assist cooling, ya that's it, that's what they do! I just left them attached as a little joke really nothing more.

Some new observations I have about this mod is. You can literally crank your speed up to much higher levels than you might guess with absolutely no slop or effect on the quality of the print and surface finish. Provided of course you compensate with adjusted heat and extrusion adjustments for the higher speeds. But mechanically it's rock solid and an excellent upgrade.

Xnaron is polishing up the files and triple checking everything to be sure it is "just right" and they should be available this week or weekend I am told. But don't hesitate to get his kit he plans to offer or order up all the bits and print em yourself.

The quality in person is really stunning. I can't express how impressed you'll be with it.

Also the magnets he recommends are plenty strong enough and even with my dual hotend tests so far the carriage has no chance of coming loose even at speeds and jerks that no sane person could or ever would print at.

P1110326_sized.jpg

P1110329_sized.jpg

P1110331_sized.jpg

P1110333.JPG


Check this out Flateric...

viewtopic.php?f=41&t=1809&p=11530#p11530

This with the stock arms, imagine with these magnetic arms?

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby xnaron » Fri May 03, 2013 3:16 pm

I'm trying to gauge how many people would be interested in this kit so I can size the first batch appropriately. Let me know via PM if you want on the list.

thanks,
Brendin
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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby xnaron » Fri May 03, 2013 3:18 pm

elqisqeyano wrote:
Did you have to drill out a hole onto the Chrome steel balls? Or did you just JB Weld them onto the screw?



Flateric welded them. My kit will use jb weld. It works very well and has held up to many hours of printing. Ultimately I would like to be able to drill a hole in the balls and glue in a 3mm stud. Drilling chrome steel is very hard. I need better carbide bits.
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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Broose » Fri May 03, 2013 5:40 pm

Flateric wrote:Hotend was e3d with bored and polished barrel, no fan at all or cooling fan for part. Dead air with head moving through it for only cooling.

How did you bore and polish the barrel of your E3d hotend?

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby elqisqeyano » Fri May 03, 2013 7:22 pm

xnaron wrote:
elqisqeyano wrote:
Did you have to drill out a hole onto the Chrome steel balls? Or did you just JB Weld them onto the screw?



Flateric welded them. My kit will use jb weld. It works very well and has held up to many hours of printing. Ultimately I would like to be able to drill a hole in the balls and glue in a 3mm stud. Drilling chrome steel is very hard. I need better carbide bits.


It's what I thought. I saw some on Ebay with tapped holes in them already but they were 1/2 inch. I will try Flateric's method and Mig weld then 4 taps strong and fast.

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Flateric » Sat May 04, 2013 1:11 am

Broose wrote:
Flateric wrote:Hotend was e3d with bored and polished barrel, no fan at all or cooling fan for part. Dead air with head moving through it for only cooling.

How did you bore and polish the barrel of your E3d hotend?


You run a softer wooden dowel through it first coated with mothers aluminium and metal polish. Then you chase that with a long thin piece of leather with same coating. The a clean bit of leather till it gleams inside.

After all the standard drilling and boring on the lathe first of course.
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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Flateric » Sat May 04, 2013 1:14 am

Well, the magnets can hold substantial weight without any I'll effects, How do I know.....

Pics are without the fan mounted on the E3d hotend which would have covered everything up. But the fan will poin straight across and blow past the Jhead hotend as well, Cooling both nicely!

dualhotend.jpg
photo (23).JPG
photo (22).JPG
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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby elqisqeyano » Sat May 04, 2013 11:11 am

Flateric wrote:Well, the magnets can hold substantial weight without any I'll effects, How do I know.....

Pics are without the fan mounted on the E3d hotend which would have covered everything up. But the fan will poin straight across and blow past the Jhead hotend as well, Cooling both nicely!

dualhotend.jpg
photo (23).JPG
photo (22).JPG


What is that orange tubing over the arrow bolts? I see you have the heat shrink over the orange tube that is over the bolt.

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Eaglezsoar » Sat May 04, 2013 11:32 am

Flateric wrote:

"You run a softer wooden dowel through it first coated with mothers aluminium and metal polish. Then you chase that with a long thin piece of leather with same coating. The a clean bit of leather till it gleams inside.

After all the standard drilling and boring on the lathe first of course."

I have the E3D and I wonder if I need to do all of this to the hotend. It won't work properly straight from the box?
I mean drilling then buffing and polishing, why did they release a hotend that needs all of that. Some of us do not
have a lathe. I'm truly disappointed if all of what you did has to be done.

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Polygonhell » Sat May 04, 2013 12:38 pm

Plenty of people seem to be using them as is, I'd say the bulk of the response is positive, I had issues with mine, but they're shipping me a replacement.

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Eaglezsoar » Sat May 04, 2013 2:04 pm

Thanks, Polygonhell I was a little concerned that these things were duds. At least I'll give it a try
as soon as I can print a mount for it.

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Flateric » Sat May 04, 2013 3:58 pm

I did this because I originally had mounted mine up in my lathe to drill and tape for the PTF connector. When I did I careelessly damaged my stainless thermal break beyond repair and had to make a new one from scratch. After doing so I noted that the piece I made seemed to leave an ever so slight lip inside between the stainless and the aluminium where they met. Knowing that my lathe is dead on centered, then reverifying it to be I tried loading my original stainless back in to check out of curiousity. Only to find the ever so slight lip had become worse.

I then loaded mine in and went on my merry way.

After reading about poly's troubles and hearing others having some small issues while yet others had none I speculated that the e3d process did not included a quick re-drill/bore AFTER assembly to ensure everything was lined up ship shape.

After my friend got one and had never used it yet, I did the same inspection only to discover that it too had the small lip at the join between coldside and stainless. No doubt this would have cause very similar issues that some people have had. So we did the same procedure to his, bore, polish and he has not had one problem either.

I'm the kinda guy who will often take apart his brand new gizmo before even using it one time, just tto check it out, verify everything is ship shape and reassemble before first use. I can not count how often this has revealed future or even immediate potential problems. I boil it down to mass market manufacturing and quality testing is not what it used to be in order to help save a few bucks in the competitive market of today.

The old saying "You get what you pay for!" is no longer totally always true. You pay for it and still not get what you pay for. But you will not go wrong double checking the work your paying for. Unless you screw the thing up of course, LOL.
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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Eaglezsoar » Sat May 04, 2013 4:59 pm

Thanks for the explanation. You must have carpal tunnel after typing all that! At least I understand now.

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Eaglezsoar » Sat May 04, 2013 5:29 pm

xnaron wrote:I'm trying to gauge how many people would be interested in this kit so I can size the first batch appropriately. Let me know via PM if you want on the list.

thanks,
Brendin


I PM'd you about wanting the kit but I was wondering?
Can my kit come with blue feathers? :D

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Flateric » Sat May 04, 2013 6:21 pm

I was wondering when or if someone would notice I left the plumage on the crossbow bolts! LOL
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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby elqisqeyano » Sat May 04, 2013 8:54 pm

Eaglezsoar wrote:Flateric wrote:

"You run a softer wooden dowel through it first coated with mothers aluminium and metal polish. Then you chase that with a long thin piece of leather with same coating. The a clean bit of leather till it gleams inside.

After all the standard drilling and boring on the lathe first of course."

I have the E3D and I wonder if I need to do all of this to the hotend. It won't work properly straight from the box?
I mean drilling then buffing and polishing, why did they release a hotend that needs all of that. Some of us do not
have a lathe. I'm truly disappointed if all of what you did has to be done.


No sir, I have the exact same Hot end. Just make sure you attach and connect fan to the fan port on the Rambo and have it run 100% all the time. You will encounter problems if you don't. From my personal experience. Here is a pic of my set up...

I added an extra fan for looks, it's not connected. I plan on using that extra fan in case I print PLA. Here is the file of the type adapter I used made by Richrap...
Attachments
Rostock_Jhead_groove_mount_V3_PUSHFIT_001_RTP.stl
(127.72 KiB) Downloaded 23 times
E3d All Metal Hot End.jpg
E3d All Metal Hot End.jpg (34.44 KiB) Viewed 556 times

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Broose » Sat May 04, 2013 10:56 pm

Flateric wrote:
Broose wrote:
Flateric wrote:Hotend was e3d with bored and polished barrel, no fan at all or cooling fan for part. Dead air with head moving through it for only cooling.

How did you bore and polish the barrel of your E3d hotend?


You run a softer wooden dowel through it first coated with mothers aluminium and metal polish. Then you chase that with a long thin piece of leather with same coating. The a clean bit of leather till it gleams inside.

After all the standard drilling and boring on the lathe first of course.

Thanks for the explanation. I had read somewhere someone suggesting that the stainless thermal breaks work best when the bore is polished to a mirror finish and was curious how you did it. Mines gotten plugged a couple of times, once due to the fan not being on and once I think related to the z height not being correct when printing the first layer. The cold end does get pretty hot if you leave the fan shroud on and don't turn on the fan. Other than that its been awesome. I believe that the short melt zone of this hot end makes for very consistent retractions, so you can dial it in perfectly, even with the Bowden setup.

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Flateric » Sun May 05, 2013 12:26 am

I agree completely, The short melt zone is key.

I've already made a second one and it seems to be great.

So I guess their design is really solid. Just unfortunately some of the singles are not up to standards. Very few BTW.

Don't let that stop you from getting one of these hotends guys. It is the best I have used easily, well worth it in every way.

I could be wrong but I heard they currently sit at a 6 weeks waiting list however. This is only a rumour however.
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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby cambo3d » Sun May 05, 2013 3:17 am

Flateric wrote:I agree completely, The short melt zone is key.

I've already made a second one and it seems to be great.

So I guess their design is really solid. Just unfortunately some of the singles are not up to standards. Very few BTW.

Don't let that stop you from getting one of these hotends guys. It is the best I have used easily, well worth it in every way.

I could be wrong but I heard they currently sit at a 6 weeks waiting list however. This is only a rumour however.



I ordered two of these ed3 hotends, couple weeks ago. there website says 3 week preorder, which was changed to 2 weeks couple days ago. so i hope this 6 week rumor is just a rumor.

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Re: Xnaron Printable Magnetic u-joint option for Rostock Max

Postby Eaglezsoar » Sun May 05, 2013 1:43 pm

The weekend is nearly over, what is the status of the magnetic joint project?
Have you decided to do kits only, release of the printable files or what?
I am not trying to rush anyone, just trying to get an update on what has been decided. :P

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