[04Feb16 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Here's where you can find the official (and unofficial too) things like assembly instructions etc...
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[04Feb16 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby geneb » Wed Nov 11, 2015 6:02 pm

Get yer docs here! :)

Rostock MAX v2 Assembly Manual, 4th Ed. : http://download.seemecnc.com/rostockmax ... dition.pdf

Rostock MAX v2 User Guide, 1st Ed. : http://download.seemecnc.com/rostockmax ... dition.pdf

Current version of the assembly manual is 4.18.

Enjoy!

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby Tincho85 » Thu Nov 12, 2015 5:35 am

Thanks Geneb.


Woaaa nice!
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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby geneb » Thu Nov 12, 2015 8:55 am

I don't wanna hear any more whinging about the power supply. :)

All of my ATX machines struggle with printing ABS @ 230C. They all appear to hit a wall around 228C (80C bed).

Now Walter, with his fancy 30W power supply (says 29 on the box, but whatevs) can nail and maintain 230C without breaking a sweat.

g.
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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby KAS » Thu Nov 12, 2015 9:12 am

now you get to hear about all those people who get shocked with open mains :)

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby scottj » Thu Nov 12, 2015 9:41 am

I just started my Max V2 rev3 last night, and started to get confused with placement of the new power supply, so this new documentation was perfect timing -- thank you!!

One comment, I noticed the hot bed instructions flip between refering to 12ga and 18ga wire.
So, I'm assuming it means 12ga.

After building the RAMBo connector with 2 of the pieces of 12ga wire (and short wires too), I have 2 extra pieces of 12 ga wire.
So, I'm using those for the Onyx hot bed. My suggestion is to make the references all to 12ga (if that's correct).

I also appreciate the new videos, I think I was the first viewer on one of them.
They are very helpful, and help make my decision to choose the Max V2.
The documentation, videos and community support really made it easy to choose the V2.
(My wife actually bought it for me for my Birthday as a surprise!)

well, back to building...

-Scott
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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby Eaglezsoar » Thu Nov 12, 2015 11:08 am

geneb wrote:I don't wanna hear any more whinging about the power supply. :)

All of my ATX machines struggle with printing ABS @ 230C. They all appear to hit a wall around 228C (80C bed).

Now Walter, with his fancy 30W power supply (says 29 on the box, but whatevs) can nail and maintain 230C without breaking a sweat.

g.


I would like to whine about the power supply. It is starting to make a whining noise. Can this be fixed with another power supply
or should I sell this printer and purchase a different printer? :o :o :o

And who is Walter? Your wife?

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby geneb » Thu Nov 12, 2015 11:37 am

Scott, do NOT use the 12ga wires on the Onyx! I'll make a note to review the text tomorrow and get it fixed.

The 12ga wire will not fit in the compression terminals along the top of the RAMBo. (nor will it fit in the physical space above the board) They'll only fit in the side connector where the power goes into the board.

Use 18ga for the wire.

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby geneb » Thu Nov 12, 2015 11:37 am

Eagle, I've named the new machine Walter "White" MAX. :)

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby geneb » Thu Nov 12, 2015 12:26 pm

Can you clarify something for me scottj? Did you get two pairs of 14" 12ga wires (2 red, 2 black) or did you get one pair and cut them down?

I just went through the Onyx chapter and no where does it say to use 12ga wire for the Onyx! What's the version number and date on the front page of the manual you're working from?

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby Eaglezsoar » Thu Nov 12, 2015 1:11 pm

geneb wrote:Can you clarify something for me scottj? Did you get two pairs of 14" 12ga wires (2 red, 2 black) or did you get one pair and cut them down?

I just went through the Onyx chapter and no where does it say to use 12ga wire for the Onyx! What's the version number and date on the front page of the manual you're working from?

g.


Version 4 mentions 12ga wire on pages 35, 37 and 41 and does refer to using 12ga for the Onyx on page 41.
I hope this helps.

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby geneb » Thu Nov 12, 2015 3:04 pm

There's a single incorrect reference on page 41. It's likely he got one of the kits that had too much 12ga wire in it.

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby Eaglezsoar » Thu Nov 12, 2015 3:18 pm

geneb wrote:There's a single incorrect reference on page 41. It's likely he got one of the kits that had too much 12ga wire in it.

g.


Gene, V4 of the manual on page 35 it says :

Now take one of the red and one of the black 12ga wires and insert them into the terminal
block. Insert the smaller 18ga wire first and THEN the 12ga wire. Just like with the smaller wire, if
you can see more than 1/16” of bare wire sticking out of the connector, trim it until it seats fully with
little or no exposure of the bare wire. Figure 3.2-3

Is it correct to put a 12ga wire in the Rambo terminal block?

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby geneb » Thu Nov 12, 2015 3:39 pm

Yes, that's correct. The power leads from the power supply to the black compression terminal block are indeed 12ga.

g.
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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby Eaglezsoar » Thu Nov 12, 2015 4:55 pm

geneb wrote:Yes, that's correct. The power leads from the power supply to the black compression terminal block are indeed 12ga.

g.


Does this mean the following pre-posted rules are no longer valid:

Re: Steves new build project. Sept 2015

Postby teoman » Sun Sep 20, 2015 12:19 pm
Just solder 10 or 12 Awg wires to the bed. And plug them in to the rambo. Upgrading later will be juat plug and play if you are not content.
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Re: Steves new build project. Sept 2015

Postby geneb » Sun Sep 20, 2015 3:30 pm
No, don't. The terminal blocks are designed for a maximum of 14ga wire. Quit telling people to force larger gauges in there.

g.

I have always understood from you and others that 14ga were the max that should be put into the terminal blocks.
What changed?

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby geneb » Thu Nov 12, 2015 5:20 pm

Two different terminal block designs, Eagle. The green plastic terminal block along the top of the RAMBo is sized such that when fully opened, it can take a maximum of 14ga wire. The black terminal block on the right edge is sized for a max of 12ga. The black terminal block is for incoming power and the green terminal block is for outgoing.

Make sense now?

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby Eaglezsoar » Thu Nov 12, 2015 7:35 pm

geneb wrote:Two different terminal block designs, Eagle. The green plastic terminal block along the top of the RAMBo is sized such that when fully opened, it can take a maximum of 14ga wire. The black terminal block on the right edge is sized for a max of 12ga. The black terminal block is for incoming power and the green terminal block is for outgoing.

Make sense now?

g.


Yes, now it makes sense and thank you for taking the time to eradicate my concerns.

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby scottj » Thu Nov 12, 2015 11:48 pm

Eaglezsoar wrote:
geneb wrote:Can you clarify something for me scottj? Did you get two pairs of 14" 12ga wires (2 red, 2 black) or did you get one pair and cut them down?

I just went through the Onyx chapter and no where does it say to use 12ga wire for the Onyx! What's the version number and date on the front page of the manual you're working from?

g.


Version 4 mentions 12ga wire on pages 35, 37 and 41 and does refer to using 12ga for the Onyx on page 41.
I hope this helps.



Yes, I got 2 black and 2 red wires, all 12ga. I was able to fan them out and solder them (with extra flux) to the bed.
After reading this, I tried to fit them into the green connector and see the 12ga will not fit.

EDIT: to clarify, I didn't have any other two wires to use on the hot bed, so I assumed (!) that I was to use the extra 2 12ga wires in the kit since I had no other option. Plus, I figured the heavier wire was part of the recent update, which seemed to make sense at the time.

I wonder if I can trim down some strands to get it to fit into the connector?
Last edited by scottj on Fri Nov 13, 2015 2:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby scottj » Thu Nov 12, 2015 11:53 pm

Another comment about the 4th Edition Assy. Guide -- I was confused about fishing the wires through the aluminum extrusion. It mentions preparing the 18 ga. wire, but no mention of when/where to use it. I figured out (from page 84) that it was meant for X axis tower.

But the docs say on page 71:

Now go ahead and pull the 22ga wire for the hot end down
the next tower extrusion and label it “X Axis”.


I think this is an error, and should be "18ga wire" instead of "22ga wire"
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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby scottj » Fri Nov 13, 2015 12:15 am

For what it's worth, this is a table I used to better understand the goals of wiring the towers...
Feel free to edit/use as you wish...

Tips/techniques I found helpful...
  • I kept the plastic wrap on the aluminum, but peeled back toward the ends to expose the cut ends to get access to the last 1" and the holes.
  • I put clear tape toward the flat side of the aluminum and labeled them X,Y,Z on both ends to keep track easier during wiring.
  • I used a stiff wire from my junk box to fish the wires through, instead of the included wire which seemed harder to fish with.

Tower Wiring Plan

    X-axis -- 18ga (for hot end)
    Y-axis -- end stop wires (from Rambo Kit)
    Z-axis -- 22ga (4x wires) for extruder motor; 26ga (4x wires, 2 pairs) for PEEK fan, Layer fan.

Reverse Wire Plan (for reference)

    Hot End -- [X axis] 18ga (4x wires)
    Extruder Stepper -- [Z axis] 22ga (4x wires)
    PEEK Fan -- [Z axis] 26ga (2x wires)
    Layer Fan -- [Z axis] 26ga (2x wires)
    End stop -- [Y axis] (6x wires, black&white from Rambo Kit)

EDIT: I uploaded a photo to show my setup for the wiring. I felt keeping the plastic on and the aluminum together made it easier to handle.

max-wiring.jpg
rostock max wiring in progress
Last edited by scottj on Fri Nov 13, 2015 8:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby geneb » Fri Nov 13, 2015 8:16 am

Scott, you'll need to take 14" of the 18ga hot end wire and use it on the Onyx. While you technically CAN use a stripping die to reduce the diameter of the 12ga wire, there's still not enough physical space above the RAMBo to permit it - even if it was safe - which it realistically is not. (chances for shorts between the two terminals)

Don't feel bad - this caught me too while I was building Walter for the new manual. I ended up having to re-shoot the video & a few of the photos.

Essentially what happened boiled down to a communications error. The RAMBo guys were asked about the compression terminals' max gauge. Thinking that SeeMeCNC was asking about the power connector, they replied "12". SeeMeCNC was either having a bad brain day or simply didn't realize that the top compression terminal block was different in more ways than just the color. That's how you ended up with the "extra" 12ga wire. I don't know how many kits got shipped in the narrow window between them changing over to the new power supply and me flipping a desk when I discovered the error. :)

Thanks for the tips & corrections. I'll make sure they're in the next update....which will be VERY soon.

It seems that they've run out of 18/4 wire (18ga, 4 cond.) and have now changed the hot end wiring to be 2 18ga (black & white) and one 26ga white (you cut in half). Now this is much more practical from an assembly standpoint, but now every bloody photo that shows those white & green wires is wrong and either needs to be re-shot, or requires bold-notice text that explains why they've got tiny white wires in their hand as opposed to the big honkin' white & green wires shown in the photo.

I write it off to "Continuous improvement can sometimes be a painful process." :D

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby mhackney » Fri Nov 13, 2015 3:22 pm

Nicely done as usual Gene. By far the best assembly and user manuals for desktop 3D printers out there!

Cheers,
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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby geneb » Fri Nov 13, 2015 5:16 pm

Thanks!

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby Eaglezsoar » Fri Nov 13, 2015 5:19 pm

mhackney wrote:Nicely done as usual Gene. By far the best assembly and user manuals for desktop 3D printers out there!

Cheers,
Michael


I agree completely Michael, I feel bad if I have to report what I think is an error, but the final goal is trying to perfect perfection
as I believe the manual is. I've seen a lot of manuals in my days in the Navy and others, and none get into the level of detail
and the great layout as Gene's manual does.

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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby geneb » Fri Nov 13, 2015 6:38 pm

Thanks Eagle. However, do NOT feel bad if you spot an error! Your Eagle eyes and those of others spot the silly things I and the guys at SeeMeCNC miss. It's a very important contribution!

The update has been uploaded - includes "A" and "B" hot end wiring changes as well as the 12/18ga wire kerfluffle fixes. :)


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Re: [11Nov15 - Rostock MAX v2, 4th Edition Manual

Postby Eaglezsoar » Fri Nov 13, 2015 6:55 pm

geneb wrote:Thanks Eagle. However, do NOT feel bad if you spot an error! Your Eagle eyes and those of others spot the silly things I and the guys at SeeMeCNC miss. It's a very important contribution!

The update has been uploaded - includes "A" and "B" hot end wiring changes as well as the 12/18ga wire kerfluffle fixes. :)


g.

Kerfluffle sounds like something makerbutt or Macintosh would make!


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