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The Original Air struder

Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 9:03 am
by Jassper
Hay all, just wanted to get this out there to you all.
Way back in late 2012 I suspended my Extruder from a few rubber bands and wire ties and showed it off at the worlds first MRRF festival in 2013. It looked god awful but it worked. I believe it was Phil Briski, a member of the MakerHive, that dubbed it "Air Struding". Another member, Jim Spencer suggested I replace the Rubber bands with Bungee cords. I cleaned up the suspension using bungees and a metal plate from an old erector set.
You can see it here at the very beginning of the video. This video was shot at the Second MRRF festival in 2014
https://youtu.be/01Lq3HVd2M4
and this video of Phil's adaption
https://youtu.be/_ZEVGcxJ0Qg

I then noticed that someone else here had the same Idea back in 2013 called the "Flying Extruder" you can read their post here
viewtopic.php?f=54&t=2070&p=14226&hilit=flying+struder#p14226
It is a complicated system of pulleys and belts.

Since then I have been working on a printable carriage for the extruder. I have a rough draft I am testing now.
Image
Image
Image

And a short video.
https://youtu.be/fsg6repCT9c

It works well and I added a support to mount a 40mm fan to help cool the extruder motor. I know some of my fellow Hive members have complained that their extruder gets really hot while printing. This will help eliminate some of that heat. My motor barley gets warm to the touch, so they may have their current set to hi. The fan can be plugged into the YellowJacket Quick change hotend plate http://www.themakerhive.com/shop/viewit ... oductid=20. As soon as I refine these STL files I will make them available for download - FREE. Hopefully within the next week or so.

The advantages of having a shorted boaden tube are simple. Less retraction needed, and way less back pressure on the nozzle. Before the shorter tube i had to print ABS at about 240c and I had to extrude slow or the extruder would strip out the filament. Now I can print ABS much faster at 220. PLA prints like a dream at 195, 40mm/s

Thoughts and suggestions welcome

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 4:48 am
by duvdev
I am wating for the files.
The question is what will happend in fast prints?
I want to print PLA in 70mm/s

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 2:43 pm
by KAS
This happens at 70mm/s :)


Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 5:10 pm
by staticbunny
I want to try this to see if it helps with a flexable filament setup.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 6:07 pm
by Jimustanguitar
staticbunny wrote:I want to try this to see if it helps with a flexable filament setup.


It depends on what extruder you're using. Flying your extruder will help with any bowden induced issues, but you'll either need to modify the EZStruder, or buy a different extruder to push flexible filaments. You have to enclose the filament the instant that it's under pressure from the drive wheel, and there are only so many extruders that do this.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:11 pm
by teoman
What extruder would you recommend for flexible filament?

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 10:01 pm
by staticbunny
Jimustanguitar wrote:
staticbunny wrote:I want to try this to see if it helps with a flexable filament setup.


It depends on what extruder you're using. Flying your extruder will help with any bowden induced issues, but you'll either need to modify the EZStruder, or buy a different extruder to push flexible filaments. You have to enclose the filament the instant that it's under pressure from the drive wheel, and there are only so many extruders that do this.


I've printed out 3 or 4 different extruders and I'm currently using this one, http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:488678 . It's not feasible for the long term for all filaments so i think shortening the bowden length would really help.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:56 pm
by Jassper
I uploaded them to http://repables.com/r/531/
Let me know how they work out for you.

I'd be happy to make changes if needed.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Tue May 10, 2016 10:33 am
by Tincho85
Recent posts gave fever for making an air-struder, it's working good but now my prints looks a bit over extruded.
Any ideas? I'm tuning retraction atm, but it doesn't seem to be the issue.

Also, the geared motor + cold end weights about 500g, is a counterweight necessary?
I've seen people on thingiverse adding one.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Tue May 10, 2016 1:57 pm
by dchauran
Tincho: check your filament diameter, and redo your dimensional accuracy calibration using this method.

viewtopic.php?f=36&t=10081

What length of bungees are people using? Most that i see are 10 inches, is that the right length?

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Tue May 10, 2016 2:26 pm
by barry99705
I counter weighted mine. Not sure on the bungee length though.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Tue May 10, 2016 3:42 pm
by Tincho85
Nice tut by 626Pilot!, thanks for sharing. I've not been reading the forum this past few weeks.
I did tune my printer some time ago using triffid's guide, but you might be right about the diameter. That particular roll had 1.67mm od when first opened. Maybe now it's wider. As soon as I get home I'll check that.

Mine is 6mm OD elastic cord. Can't remember the length though. But I'm using a custom made design for the geared stepper, not the air-struder.

One thing I've been experimenting with is the cord tension.
If it's not to tight the cold end tends to bounce when printing too fast.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Tue May 10, 2016 5:16 pm
by miglo
Tincho85 wrote:Recent posts gave fever for making an air-struder, it's working good but now my prints looks a bit over extruded.
Any ideas? I'm tuning retraction atm, but it doesn't seem to be the issue.

Also, the geared motor + cold end weights about 500g, is a counterweight necessary?
I've seen people on thingiverse adding one.


I use light bands to counterweight mine. May not even be necessary with new titan and a VERY small nema motor, but still.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Tue May 10, 2016 8:18 pm
by Tincho85
What are light bands? Google pics shows me something different.
Do you mind sharing a picture of your setup?

Btw... the filament is now 1.8mm!
That's what happens when you buy cheap ones :(

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Wed May 11, 2016 4:16 am
by miglo
Tincho85 wrote:What are light bands? Google pics shows me something different.
Do you mind sharing a picture of your setup?

Btw... the filament is now 1.8mm!
That's what happens when you buy cheap ones :(


Something like this:

http://www.amazon.com/Dritz-9330B-Braid ... 1_6&sr=8-6

My current rostock is extra tall (780mm z length), so all the wires + flyingstruder can add up. This helps tremendously.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Sat May 14, 2016 8:24 pm
by barry99705
Here's my current setup. Picked up 3 key-bak keyring tethers to replace the ghetto hard drive pendulum I had going. I tried to not have to have the 3 bungies, but the motor swung around too much, so now the bungees are there just as shock absorbers, they're not really holding any weight.
Image
Here's the link to the full sized pic.
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/F ... directlink

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Sun May 15, 2016 4:29 am
by DeltaCon
Has anyone ever thought up some kind of stepper cooler for a flying struder? I like the idea, but it is nit very good combineable with a heatchamber unless you have some extra active cooling on the extruder stepper.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Sun May 15, 2016 8:07 pm
by barry99705
DeltaCon wrote:Has anyone ever thought up some kind of stepper cooler for a flying struder? I like the idea, but it is nit very good combineable with a heatchamber unless you have some extra active cooling on the extruder stepper.


It would have to be liquid cooled, or you're just going to be blowing hot air over the motor.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Sun May 15, 2016 8:57 pm
by Tincho85
Thanks miglo.

I used tu have a heatsink with a cooling fan attached to the stepper motor, but I removed it now and left only the heatsink.
With the air-struder system the motor is running much cooler than before, even inside the heated chamber.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Mon May 16, 2016 3:27 am
by nebbian
Jassper wrote:Hay all, just wanted to get this out there to you all.
Way back in late 2012 I suspended my Extruder from a few rubber bands and wire ties and showed it off at the worlds first MRRF festival in 2013. It looked god awful but it worked. I believe it was Phil Briski, a member of the MakerHive, that dubbed it "Air Struding". Another member, Jim Spencer suggested I replace the Rubber bands with Bungee cords. I cleaned up the suspension using bungees and a metal plate from an old erector set.


Hey Jassper,

I just wanted to thank you for sharing your files. I came across your "Air Struder" a couple of months ago, and remixed it to be more compatible with a wider range of extruders. My remix is here:
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1259941

At the time I tried to contact you to let you know what I'd done, but wasn't successful. Hopefully now the message has gotten to you :)

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Mon May 16, 2016 12:07 pm
by DGBK
Hey Nebbian. I just looked at your link to Thingiverse. It looks like you are using the exact same extruder that I am, but that you added some sort of filament guide to it. I see something black that looks to be screwed below the hobbed gear and bearing. Is that something you designed? If so, would you mind sharing it? I've been meaning to design a guide to go there, but I haven't gotten around it it.

Thanks

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Mon May 16, 2016 10:19 pm
by nebbian
Hi DGBK,

Yep it's the one attached. I've been meaning to put it on Thingiverse for a while.

You need to drill out the lower pushfit connector so that the bowden tube goes through the lower bracket, all the way right to the drive gear. Then this part supports the bowden tube to stop it buckling. It requires one small screw to clamp to the bowden tube.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Mon May 16, 2016 10:40 pm
by DGBK
Thank you. I already have my push connector drilled out, but I noticed that the bowden tube tends to work up towards it every few prints. My hope is that this will stop that.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Tue May 17, 2016 4:37 pm
by Jassper
nebbian wrote:
Jassper wrote:Hay all, just wanted to get this out there to you all.
Way back in late 2012 I suspended my Extruder from a few rubber bands and wire ties and showed it off at the worlds first MRRF festival in 2013. It looked god awful but it worked. I believe it was Phil Briski, a member of the MakerHive, that dubbed it "Air Struding". Another member, Jim Spencer suggested I replace the Rubber bands with Bungee cords. I cleaned up the suspension using bungees and a metal plate from an old erector set.


Hey Jassper,

I just wanted to thank you for sharing your files. I came across your "Air Struder" a couple of months ago, and remixed it to be more compatible with a wider range of extruders. My remix is here:
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1259941

At the time I tried to contact you to let you know what I'd done, but wasn't successful. Hopefully now the message has gotten to you :)


Looks Great neddian!
I'll be posting another version soon my self. Should work with just about every extruder out there.

Re: The Original Air struder

Posted: Wed May 18, 2016 6:50 pm
by kraegar
Jassper - thanks for your airstruder, I obviously used your idea for the one I posted (and gave you full credit!) - yours looks much nicer than mine, though! Looking forward to seeing what you come up with for a new design, too.

Been one of the best mods I've done thus far, wish I'd done it far sooner.