Tuning Simplify3d Profile

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wepollock
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Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Thu Jan 25, 2018 10:08 pm

I have been tuning a Simplify3d profile; I was able to print out a Benchy with reasonable results. You can see from the profile that I started from a "Wasp" configuration file. There have been seven changes from the original configuration and I have a changelog so I can roll back if necessary.

I am currently playing around to find the correct infill extrusion width. I had an issue early on with "ping ponging" which I traced down to "thin wall behavior" Any tuning ideas would be appreciated!


https://www.dropbox.com/s/juptkz89g6swj ... e.fff?dl=0

Noircogi
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby Noircogi » Wed Feb 28, 2018 5:50 pm

I tried your profile, but it was under-extruding (0.95) and the speeds are very low for the Artemis.
What made you choose the bed size you did? Are you going for max height?

Noircogi
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby Noircogi » Wed Feb 28, 2018 7:29 pm

Here's my version. It's running rated speeds and sizes, limits layer times based on the performance of the cooling fans and pre-heats both the hot-end and the bed in parallel. Benchies come out very nice, especially considering the speeds and 0.25 layer height.

https://pastebin.com/cpjp7jqr

wepollock
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:00 am

Thanks for the profile.

I initially set me speed to 3600 which was the setting in the Cura profile. I had the speed as high as 4200. I am currently running 2800. I had no concerns with extrusion multiplier at 90. I tend to print with higher layers heights mostly .35 and .25.

wepollock
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:29 am

Yep you are going fast.

What made you choose the bed size you did?

Confusing as it is; Simplify 3d sizes x and y as a square within a circle; A Square circumscribed by a circle.

https://www.varsitytutors.com/hotmath/hotmath_help/topics/squares-circumscribed-by-circles

I tested with an stl file of a 290cm disk; it fits exactly into build area with a bit to spare.
I am able to print very close to the bed clips.

With your process file I am able to fit a 400mm disk into the build area. You would be printing outside the print envelope.

Looking at several profiles (rostock max and yours) I will change a few speed settings upwards; retraction and xy speed. I am version 36 of the profile now.

wepollock
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:29 pm

Current PLA simplify3d factory file

https://www.dropbox.com/s/d791fxfsytmhl ... ctory?dl=0



Why do I have such a low extrusion multiplier?
-- "It is typical for PLA to print with an extrusion multiplier near 0.9"
-- I am not getting perimeter gaps
-- I am not getting under extrusion
-- I am not grinding
-- It's a possible alternative to raising temperature

I am printing an 8 ring keychain, its printing very clean and silently.
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby geneb » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:57 pm

The only comment I have is that you've got all three of your bed clips backwards. Rotate them 180 degrees. :D

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wepollock
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Fri Mar 02, 2018 7:45 pm

LOL..

And here I thought that the bed stayed in place via adhesion or cohesion! Not a single layer shift!, with no bed clip contact.

Got any doughnuts on yah! :lol: :o

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wepollock
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Mon Mar 05, 2018 4:53 pm


wepollock
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Mon Mar 26, 2018 1:51 pm

Latest profile (using a geared extruder; with a little more than 100mm calibrated)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/usgef03o9a99ouu/Art64.fff?dl=0

AS a side note, I have been getting great prints with PETG, very minimal if any stringing, without retraction enabled and a 2mm coast.
I am currently trying the same with PLA.

If "feels to me" that retract is relieving pressure more than it is sucking plastic back, through the long filament path. Why not just keep the filament flow going in the same direction and then just figure out the sweet spot with coast. I am now testing 0 to to retract with .7 z-hop; so I am lifting the effector w/o doing an extruder retract. The print is actually better than it was before. The print does have a small indentation due to a bit aggressive coast (which can be tuned down); the finish on the print is great. The only artifact is travel, which is set to run inside the part.

With a geared extruder it feels like I have exchanged speed for torque. The only thing 24v would be relevant to (math wise) is the extruder speed.
If I wanted more responsive retract, it might pay to put the extruder right on the effector.

wepollock
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Mon Mar 26, 2018 9:47 pm

This is w/o retraction..

There is absolutely no artifacts on the print.. Its shiny as can be; no blobs, zits. The Z-seam feels like a small indentation, its not noticeable or even very visible unless you look for it.

The only concern is with travel moves (which are set to occur over the interior walls of the print. ) there is some unwanted deposition because there is still some pressure in the hot end. If I was not printing a thin wall there might be some string on the interior of the print. Next print I might try a longer coast (by .25/ or in .25 increments); thereafter I might enable retract of .5mm up to 3mm.

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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby dc42 » Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:00 am

wepollock wrote:This is w/o retraction..

There is absolutely no artifacts on the print.. Its shiny as can be; no blobs, zits. The Z-seam feels like a small indentation, its not noticeable or even very visible unless you look for it.

The only concern is with travel moves (which are set to occur over the interior walls of the print. ) there is some unwanted deposition because there is still some pressure in the hot end. If I was not printing a thin wall there might be some string on the interior of the print. Next print I might try a longer coast (by .25/ or in .25 increments); thereafter I might enable retract of .5mm up to 3mm.


Are you using pressure advance?

wepollock
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Tue Mar 27, 2018 8:55 am

DC - I read about Pressure Advance late last night. It's exactly the behavior I have been looking to address with coast. It looks like Pressure advance works in time, and with timing, while coast is static distance "on to off" I will enable it in my Gcode preamble.

It looks like a great feature that is going to push more pressure at the start of a move and reduce pressure in time - with extruder speed reduction at the end of the move.

The downside of Coast is that it is a "blunt instrument" in that you are toggling on/off. My print quality on the last run indicates to me that retraction is less desirable. The capricorn tubing helps a little bit.

M572 D0 S0.1

https://duet3d.dozuki.com/Wiki/Pressure_advance

M572: Set or report extruder pressure advance
Parameters

Dnnn Extruder number
Snnn Pressure advance amount (in seconds)
Examples

M572 D0 S0.1 ; set extruder 0 pressure advance to 0.1 seconds
M572 D0:1:2 S0.2 ; set extruder 0, 1 and 2 pressure advance to 0.2 seconds (RepRapFirmware 1.20 and later)
This sets the pressure advance coefficient (S parameter) for the specified extruder (D parameter). Supported by RepRapFirmware-dc42, -ch and -dn.

Pressure advance causes the extruder drive position to be advanced or retarded during printing moves by an additional amount proportional to the rate of extrusion. At the end of a move when the extrusion rate is decreasing, this may result in the extruder drive moving backwards (i.e. retracting). Therefore, if you enable this feature, you may need to reduce the amount of retraction you use in your slicing program to avoid over-retraction.

For Bowden extruders, an S value between 0.1 and 0.25 usually gives the best print quality. Direct extruders need smaller values, for example 0.05. Mixing hot ends need larger values.

I have turned retract off; and coast off - here is a preamble

G90
M83
M106 S255
G4 P500
M106 S0
M140 S60
M190 S60
M104 S200 T0
M109 S200 T0
G28 ; home all
M572 D0 S0.1

G1 Z0.925 F1200
; process Process1
; layer 1, Z = 0.225
T0
; tool H0.250 W0.567
; skirt
G1 X5.428 Y-50.015 F9000

PS... I am looking forward to the beach - 3d printing (and working in semi-retirement) takes a big back seat to that.
Last edited by wepollock on Tue Mar 27, 2018 10:23 am, edited 3 times in total.

wepollock
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:53 am

Pressure Advance..

Layers look great, I don't see blobs or zits at this point.
On small moves within the first layer the filament is too sparse. (where the effector goes back and forth rapidly, starts and stops rapidly).

Interactively;

I tuned it down mid-print to M572 D0 S0.06 in increments of .02...
Later today I will re-print the part with that setting.

The extruder is far more active, it is working in time with the effector.

wepollock
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Tue Mar 27, 2018 5:43 pm

Pressure Advance of M572 D0 S0.06 has vastly improved print quality.

Here is the difference in printing 7 ring gyro's;

without pressure advance - I had to tune the slicer to provide clearance between the rings
--had to distribute the next layer all over the print
--had to reduce extrusion width
--had to reduce temperature 200-193

with pressure advance
--able to print the next layer in an optimized way
--was able to increase extrusion width
--able to increase printing temperature to 210
(increased fan speed to 80% - the inner ring is now flawless)
as a plus I am printing faster.


This is the best quality PLA print to date.
the picture does not do the print justice..
Image

sandy
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby sandy » Thu Mar 29, 2018 2:10 am

What are your new Simplify3D settings with pressure advance? I'm getting a lot of stringing when I try it.

thanks.

wepollock
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Thu Mar 29, 2018 7:39 am

I am using a geared extruder. You might have to tune the setting on the command line.


try up in small increments of .02
M572 D0 S0.1
try down in small increments of .02

Also what temperature were you using? What material?
Duet interface extrusion multiplier can be used to reduce the flow into the extruder as well.


http://www.dropbox.com/s/fcbrxvbfn9gfiw1/preasadv.factory?dl=0
PS.. check the settings -- i jigger them around based on the model I am printing - based on preview.

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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby KB9AVO » Wed Apr 04, 2018 10:58 am

I have to ask .. are you downloading thru the network or via a card or thru a usb cable?? I ace used CURU and was painless, BUT much used to S3D with a former machine ... but it will not talk to my Artemis

Thanks Paul

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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Wed Apr 04, 2018 11:33 am

Hello Paul..

I am printing wirelessly. I think I remember seeing some issues with USB, if I recollect with "ground loop." I don't think that you should be printing over USB. From what I can tell. USB is just a way to set the machine up. I am using a dedicated router for 3d printing, that attaches to my Verizon router via Ethernet My suggestion is get a cheap router or access point, use the USB to setup Networking on the Duet, then just upload files. Here is how; http://duet3d.dozuki.com/Guide/1.%29+Ge ... /7?lang=en

BTW a low end router costs about as much as an access point, but it's more configurable.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003Y5 ... UTF8&psc=1



The Seemecnc Cura profile was great.
I like the interface of Simplify3d. The strong points of Simplify3d to me are preview, supports, thin line support, travel over infill, to have different settings per layer, and mostly because I am an old dog who is resistant to new tricks.. Also some of the experimental features of Cura have been in Simplify3d for a long time, I read an old quote from DC (a real expert on allot of things) on the Duet website that stated that "Cura produces better Gcode, last he looked." I think, based on my initial use of it, that CURA has better tunability. Hackney (an expert on this blog) likes kisslicer. I would assume it has the best tuning and Gcode if he is using it. http://www.sublimelayers.com/ <I am learning lots of stuff there.

What is nice about DUET is that lots of things are GCode tunable; at the command line. eg; I am using Pressure Advance in place of retract.

I would hope that Simplify3d would update their software so it connects to the duet web interface. I remember seeing some Seemecnc documentation for Cura Integration to the Duet interface.

So there is lots of ways to skin a cat.

wepollock
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Re: Tuning Simplify3d Profile

Postby wepollock » Thu Apr 05, 2018 8:50 am

I will be moving select Gcode commands from config.g to my print job preamble in Simplify3d
I was thinking of how I would have to manage several extruder types in config.g and I realized that I could just move a command from config.g to slicer.

I am going to move M569 M92 to my slicer preamble.

I don't know if you would want to move machine definition commands from config.g to your slicer; but I think you could.


https://duet3d.dozuki.com/Wiki/Gcode

A key difference from other 3d printer firmwares is not employing a separate command set (other than G-codes) to configure the printer. To that end RepRapFirmware has a large collection of configuration g-codes that allow the behaviour of the machine to be controlled.

The advantage of "G-code everywhere" is the same commands can be send from any of the G-Code sources, and originate from the user, a UI, macro or file and it will generate the same response from the firmware. This greatly improves the ease and power of firmware configuration and operation.


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